SDCC Countdown Continues With Raising Of Banners

sdcc

San Diego Comic Con (SDCC) is almost here! As the excitement builds for one of the most popular comic con conventions in the world, the banners for the event have been raised.

The banners as pictured below feature the tagline “celebrating the popular arts” and a picture of Marvel’s upcoming Doctor Strange. Could this mean that Doctor Strange will be having a large presence at the event? Disney has used SDCC to promote a large number of their popular properties including showing off the complete cast of the Avengers, in an unforgettable panel.

 

Warner Bros. will also be making a large impact on the con this year. A daily Suicide Squad event has already been announced. San Diego’s Hard Rock Hotel will be the home of one of this unique/interactive main event for fans and it will be taking place daily during the con from 10 a.m. to 7 p.m.. Fans will be able to walk in and be a part of Belle Reve penitentiary in real-life.

The entire hotel will be transformed. Along with witnessing this incredibly transformation, the event will be complete with a live-action virtual reality experience, getting their own ink at Harley Quinn’s tattoo show and they will be able to take photos in the Belle Reve cells.

SDCC kicks off on July 21st and runs through the 24th. Are you planning on attending? Lets talk all things SDCC!

Chelsea Lewis

Chelsea Lewis

Chelsea Lewis, TV division, joined Heroic Hollywood in 2016. Prior to joining the team at Heroic, she worked for TheCelebrityCafe.com covering everything from music to...

  • SAMURAI36

    WB/DC is gonna dominate this year, just as they do every year!!

    • Lupin

      Theyre going to crush it!
      Disney/MARVEL scaling back is not going to do them any favors. They have Dr. Strange and should drop trailer #1 & GoTG2 and they can do something with Captain Marvel teasing her appearance in GoTG2.
      But WB/DC is just going to slay. Suicide Squad alone could not be setup for the alley oop any more perfectly. I beginning to wonder if the post-SDCC date was strategic marketing. I hope they have a few screenings that set the con on fire with a buzz. Wonder Woman should give us its first trailer, I see no reason why not. It will be 11months from launch. I have the feeling that JL might not be present, there’s no reason for them to be since the movie is over a year out. I think we might get a video message saying hello from the set, but I dont even think we will get any pics or a synopsis until later this year and 1st trailer will probably be a Superbowl affair in Feb ’17

      • SAMURAI36

        Absolutely agreed.

        Also, I don’t think it’s a thing of Marvel scaling back. I just don’t think they have an awful lot of product to present.

        I honestly don’t think Dr Strange is gonna bring down anyone’s house. Perhaps as a 1-2 punch with GOTG2, maybe they’ll make some noise.

        But honestly, Marvel hasn’t brought the house down with SDCC since that first Avengers announcement. Ever since WB stepped their game up, Marvel has either been dwarfed, or they jumped ship entirely.

        Also, WB/DC succeeds where Marvel/Disney continues to fail; Marvel’s multimedia content is next to non-existent, they have no video game content, little to no animation content, and the well on their live TV content is slowly drying up. They are becoming a one-trick pony, with the movies.

        Meanwhile, DC will showcase the Killing Joke, will likely premiere the pilot for Powerless, and it’s a pretty safe bet that they will be showcasing Injustice at the Con.

        Bear in mind, that Marvel’s showing at their vaunted D23 last year was a bust as well. The Marvel presentation lasted about 10-15 minutes, and amounted to Feige basically saying “G’night everybody!!”, and that was it.

        I don’t expect much different this year.

        • Axxell

          Marvel is concentrated on nailing the actual release of their content, rather than nailing a marketing event. Sure SDCC is a good showcase event, but as we all know, showing too much content too soon kills the hype by the time it actually does release.

          As for Marvel becoming a “one trick pony”, what Marvel is doing is setting a strategy first instead of just peppering all media with some form of content. They’ve already dominated movies with this strategy; now they’re slowly but surely becoming the masters of comic book TV content as well, with Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Agents of SHIELD, Luke Cage, Punisher, Iron Fist, Damage Control and the upcoming Defenders.

          • Lupin

            I think MARVEL is doing better in TV imo The strange thing is that the Netflix MARVEL shows are more serious and the DC TV shows are more campy.
            Disney just scrapped their Infinity games division. Im sure that MARVEL is envious of the boffo success of Batman: Arkham series and INJUSTICE. I wonder how they will counter, will be very interesting to see.

          • SAMURAI36

            The question is, WHEN they will “counter”. Axxell claims that there’s this slow building master plan, but as I’d said previously, Disney has all but scrapped the video game divisions of most of their franchises.

            Also, I don’t think “campy or serious” is a real factor in regards to what’s successful these days. Otherwise, DC films would be lauded as the greatest ever, and Marvel’s just the opposite.

            Besides, AoShit was rather campy as well, and we see what happened with that.

            Marvel’s TV content is no where near the success that its movie content is. Which I’ve always said is very telling, considering how Marvel tried to convince people that “it’s all connected”, but the 100’s of millions of people who flock to their films, are nowhere to be seen, when it comes to these TV shows. It’s almost a 90% drop-off from theater to TV.

            As good as Daredevil was reported to be, where’s the viewership? It’s a shame, when Gotham and Lucifer (neither of which are A) connected to any movie universe, and B) don’t feature prominent characters) are beating DD and the other Marvel Netflix stuff, as it pertains to viewer count.

            I have yet to get an explanation as to why that is.

          • Axxell

            The question is, WHEN they will “counter”. Axxell claims that there’s this slow building master plan, but as I’d said previously, Disney has all but scrapped the video game divisions of most of their franchises.

            It makes more sense that instead of trying to be a jack of all trades, master of none, they just save their efforts and come up with a tailored plan for making videogames. They don’t seem to be in a rush to do something.

            Also, I don’t think “campy or serious” is a real factor in regards to what’s successful these days. Otherwise, DC films would be lauded as the greatest ever, and Marvel’s just the opposite.

            That I will agree with…it’s all about quality content, not whether it’s lighthearted or not.

            Marvel’s TV content is no where near the success that its movie content is. Which I’ve always said is very telling, considering how Marvel tried to convince people that “it’s all connected”, but the 100’s of millions of people who flock to their films, are nowhere to be seen, when it comes to these TV shows. It’s almost a 90% drop-off from theater to TV.

            That’s a false metric to judge the success of the shows on. Film and TV mediums are 2 different animals; no one would expect every movie watcher to tune in every week to watch the shows. And considering no one had attempted to tie the movie and TV universe like this before, any help that the movies provided to promote the show and vice versa can be considered a win. AoS still has higher ratings than any other comic book based TV show currently on the air, despite it’s long standing lack of identifiable comic book characters.

            As good as Daredevil was reported to be, where’s the viewership? It’s a shame, when Gotham and Lucifer (neither of which are A) connected to any movie universe, and B) don’t feature prominent characters) are beating DD and the other Marvel Netflix stuff, as it pertains to viewer count.

            I have yet to get an explanation as to why that is.

            Easy…it’s BS. Show me some numbers proving otherwise. Like I said, neither of those shows can beat even Agents of SHIELD, which you hate so much.

          • SAMURAI36

            It makes more sense that instead of trying to be a jack of all trades, master of none, they just save their efforts and come up with a tailored plan for making videogames. They don’t seem to be in a rush to do something.

            So wait, if they’re not in a rush, then how do you know they are coming up with a “tailored plan”?

            And meanwhile, where’s they “tailored plan” for their terrible animation, that I noticed you left out of the conversation? How many years (decades!!) has that plan been in motion?

            You have the backing of THE biggest animation giant in all of Hollywood, and you can’t put together a single animated series or movie?

            You talk about “bread and butter” in your last post; last I checked, animation is what brought Superheroes as a whole to the table of public consumption in the first place.

            Not movies.

            That’s a false metric to judge the success of the shows on. Film and TV mediums are 2 different animals; no one would expect every movie watcher to tune in every week to watch the shows.

            So now films and TV are different? Because you had no problems making that comparison in your previous post.

            Anyways, no one is talking about “every movie watcher”. But you’d have to be blind, not to recognize that a 90% drop-off is ridiculous. In no form or fashion, can you justify going from 100’s of millions of viewers, who PAY to see you content, to 5M (+/-) viewers, who won’t watch your content for free. Even when you’re trying to sell that same audience on the idea that the content is essentially the same, from medium to medium.

            At this point, I think it’s fair to say that the majority of Marvel TV viewership consists of the Marvel die-hards like yourself.

            And considering no one had attempted to tie the movie and TV universe like this before, any help that the movies provided to promote the show and vice versa can be considered a win.

            Yes, while that is indeed commendable, that doesn’t automatically translate into a “win”. There are no “A’s for effort” with this. One of these days, you are going to have to acknowledge that Marvel’s marketing tactic of “#it’s all connected” didn’t really work. In fact, it got them no more the amount of viewers, than DC, who has no connection with their movies.

            So no, that’s not a “win”, if the opposition was able to accomplish more or less the same thing, with a totally different tactic. In fact, it equals to a zero sum.

            AoS still has higher ratings than any other comic book based TV show currently on the air, despite it’s long standing lack of identifiable comic book characters.

            OMG, you sound so incredibly stupid saying this. I know you didn’t post any links to support your claim, and I won’t even bother asking you to do so.

            Instead, I’ll post them myself:

            http://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/marvels-agents-of-shield-season-three-ratings-38242/

            Unfortunately for ABC, Marvel’s Agents of SHIELD has never lived up to ratings expectations and become a hit for the network. It did okay in the first season and then viewership dropped more than 30% in season two. Will the ratings continue to fall? Could it be cancelled or is it almost guaranteed to be renewed for a fourth season to have enough episodes for syndication? Stay tuned.

            That’s the first quote at the top of that page. AoShit bottomed out, with an AWFUL low of >3M viewers.

            Easy…it’s BS. Show me some numbers proving otherwise. Like I said, neither of those shows can beat even Agents of SHIELD, which you hate so much.

            You could have easily found this yourself, but you want me to do the heavy lifting, so here’s DC’s ratings:

            http://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/gotham-season-two-ratings-38069/
            Gotham = 4M viewers

            http://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/the-flash-season-two-ratings-38406/
            Flash = 3.5M viewers

            http://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/lucifer-season-one-ratings/
            Lucifer = 4.6M viewers

            http://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/supergirl-season-one-ratings-39121/
            Supergirl = 7.7M viewers

            So yes, both those shows are beating AoShit. I’m betting Preacher’s ratings will beat AoShit as well, when its season runs.

            Now granted, AoShit is doing better than shows like Arrow, but A) not by much , and B) arguably, Arrow was in a bit of a slump this season. However, the fact remains, AoShit is on a perfect time slot, and is on a major network, whereas Arrow isn’t. This, on top of the fact that, ONCE AGAIN, it’s connected to a massive movie juggernaut.

            Also, you stated:

            AoS still has higher ratings than any other comic book based TV show currently on the air, despite it’s long standing lack of identifiable comic book characters.

            And yet, Walking Dead’s numbers blow out everybody’s:

            http://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/the-walking-dead-season-six-ratings-38649/

            So that blows your statement clear out of the bathtub.

          • SAMURAI36

            Oh man, so look at this turd that Marvel is putting out:

            http://www.bleedingcool.com/2016/07/03/marvel-contest-of-champions-introduces-civil-warrior/

            LMAO, Civil Warrior.

            And once again, look at the comments:

            And the Civil Warrior can be yours, if you can score higher than 13 million points against grinders that don’t apparently sleep ever. Or you can spend thousands on crystals that may contain the Civil Warrior, but you’ll swear he’s not in there, then hear your friend found him in one crystal, so now you have to kill said friend.

            Seriously, the game is an addict’s nightmare. Never play it.

            So, no “this game is awesome, I can’t stop playing it!!”, just reason after reason of why not to play it.

            Worst customer service ever, game glitches for all on a daily basis (lag, short combos, etc,..P2p that only serves good for big spenders, and is geared for spending money or suffer. 2 years of game and I will tell all to Stay away

            Well now, that’s a condemning critique if I ever heard one. I thought I was gonna have to ad-lib my way thru this one, but the poster said more than I ever could.

            I stopped playing this game because it’s so obsessed with Civil War. I get it, it’s a movie tie in but this has been going 3 months now and it’s boring.

            *Gasp* A “boring Marvel game”? Say it ain’t so!! LMAO

          • SAMURAI36

            Just to show how, week by week, Marvel is slowly losing ground to DC in the comics arena:

            http://www.bleedingcool.com/2016/07/03/bleeding-cool-bestseller-list-3rd-july-2016-even-with-a-skip-week-dc-get-two-rebirth-comics-into-the-top-ten/

            Even with a 5th week skip, DC still holds their ground against Marvel. Some of the comments from different retailers around the country:

            With it being a 5th Wednesday to the month it was a weird week. DC took the top spot with the Dark Knight III issue 5. Marvel took the rest of the slots with out any real challenge from DC. That said it was a heck of a drop off sales wise from the other Wednesdays in June. Marvel seems to have had a drop of interest. Captain America Steve Rogers 2 had people complaining how it still felt like Marvel lied about it not being mind control but being reality control instead thanks to Marvel spoiling the issue on Tuesday. No idea how many people will be around for the 3rd issue. Lots of negative blow back from the stunt. Uncanny Inhumans did well thanks to the intro of a certain new character.

            Hmm, a “drop of interest”…. Surely they’re not talking about the all-powerful Marvel?

            Captain America: Steve Rogers #2 was the clear winner this week. That being said sales of this months DC rebirths titles beat all of the rest of this week’s new releases. So DC Rebirth appears to be unstoppable even during a skip week.

            So, the only reason Craptain America made the list, is because people wanna see how he turns into a N&zi. Nice.

            It’s no surprise that Dark Knight III: Master Race #5 would take first place in our store this week–after all, DC didn’t ship any new Rebirth titles. What IS surprising, though, is that DC took two Top Ten slots in our store with new printings of books for which we still have the earlier printings in stock! Even worse for Marvel, Captain America: Steve Rogers #2 could only climb to FIFTH place in our store–and Uncanny Inhumans #11, with its hyped first appearance of a supposedly major new character, didn’t even make our Top Ten! We still have ample stacks of both should readers decide to pick them up later–but with a full wave of Rebirth books slated for release next week, this week was Marvel’s last big shot at knocking DC out of the Top Ten, and it failed pretty spectacularly with our customers.

            Man, they have “stacks of Marvel books” left….. And Marvel had the nerve to wanna bribe people into tearing up DC books? Hmm, imagine that….

            Strong sales of Silver Age Spider-Man and single issues of the original Watchmen series were the only noteworthy trends this week.

            Meaning, nothing new from Marvel even made it on the radar.

            A great week once again and that was with mostly just 2nd and 3rd prints coming out.Dark Knight took the top spot with nothing even coming close to be considered competition.

            Hmm, really? Nothing from Marvel was considered comp? Well, that’s interesting.

            Marvel returns this week since DC had a skip week with a few annuals and little fanfare. The real challenge is next week when DC has their second issues ship and launches a few more books in July. Should be interesting. Civil War tie ins still not really catching on in our store.

            Hmm, so nobody gives an Uck-fay about Civil War? That’s interesting…

            Still selling tons of Rebirth issues to new people everyday. We finally ran out of Flash Rebirth 1 and Titans Rebirth 1, but still have all the rest left at cover price in our store. Can’t believe all the new customers that have found us this last month. I hope the momentum stays with us and especially appreciate DC willing to back up their books with full returnability. Although it looks like we won’t be sending anything back at all. Still selling tons of Walking Dead back issues every week. And Saga as well.

            Not even a mention of Marvel. How unfortunate….

            Wow…it’s amazing what happens when DC’s Rebirth skips a week. Marvel took over the Top Ten, and DC had only Dark Knight 3 make the list (and even then, it’s no where near selling as well as it once did). Mark Millar’s Jupiter’s Legacy, Rick and Morty, and Lady Mechanika were the only indie books that hit for us, the rest was all Marvel (even if the news of another relaunch has caused a near constant stream of gripes coming our way from customers)

            So, Marvel took over, simply in lieu of DC’s absence. And even then, people are still complaining about what Marvel is doing. Who’da thunk it?

            So yeah, I’m gonna beat you in the head with a weekly reminder of how well DC is doing, and how terrible Marvel is doing.

            It’s gonna be a hard next few weeks for you, Axxey. See ya in 7!!

          • Axxell

            So you found a week where DC had the better performance…good for you.

            Cal me when this changes:

            http://www.comichron.com/vitalstatistics/graphs/MarketSharesbyYear.jpg

          • SAMURAI36

            Marvel is concentrated on nailing the actual release of their content, rather than nailing a marketing event.

            Is that so? Well, perhaps if they’d done more marketing for Ant-Man, it wouldn’t have flopped.

            Sure SDCC is a good showcase event, but as we all know, showing too much content too soon kills the hype by the time it actually does release.

            I don’t know that “we all know that”. In fact, DC showcases pilot eps for most of their DCTV content, and each of them has opened to huge numbers. Also, They showcase all of their animated movies each year, and they each end up being high sellers.

            As for Marvel becoming a “one trick pony”, what Marvel is doing is setting a strategy first instead of just peppering all media with some form of content.

            LMAO at this. They’ve been setting a “strategy” for nearly a decade, and with the exception of movies, very little of that has panned out.

            Disney has all but shut down any/all video game studios for nearly all its franchises (Marvel, Star Wars, etc). Even the author of a recent Rolling Stone article spoke on it, during his coverage of Injustice 2:

            http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/news/injustice-2-dc-comics-coo-ed-boon-reveal-game-secrets-20160608

            Ever since Disney bought Star Wars, there hasn’t been a decent game, and the games have been coming out less and less frequently. Whereas, prior to Disney, Lucasfilm released a SW game not only a couple of times a year, but they were on a variety of platforms, and they were mostly bestsellers.

            Disney pretty much shut down their Infinity model. And it’s not like that was getting rave reviews, otherwise it wouldn’t have gotten shut down.

            And let’s not talk about the shameful travesty that is Marvel animation. The last undisputed hit show since the X-Men in the 90’s. And Spidey &HAF in the 80’s before that. And that’s animated series, as well as movies.

            LOL at “peppering”, though. I’d actually assert that what DC doing, instead of “peppering”, is giving people a full course meal of multimedia entertainment. Everywhere else Marvel fails, DC succeeds. And, whereas movies is pretty much all that Marvel is consistently offering, that could be looked at as the dessert to the meal.

            DC has been consistently offering multimedia product since the 30’s. Every decade since, they’ve presented long standing product on radio, TV (live and animation), and in a plethora of other forms, while Marvel has struggled.

            Speaking of which:

            They’ve already dominated movies with this strategy; now they’re slowly but surely becoming the masters of comic book TV content as well, with Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Agents of SHIELD, Luke Cage, Punisher, Iron Fist, Damage Control and the upcoming Defenders.

            I like how you attempt to frame this, even though it’s rather inaccurate.

            First, LMAO at “masters of TV content”. I know you like to think that Disney lumping their Marvel content on Netflix is some sort of “win”, but the numbers don’t support that. Also, Marvel has failed at actual TV content.

            As you well know (but for some reason, have opted not to mention here), AoShit’s ratings have bottomed out. All their other TV projects have either been cancelled, or shut down in pre-production. It’s funny that you mention Damage Control, since at this point, DC is the first to launch that very same concept, and it will only look like Marvel is trying to copy DC in that regard. That’s if it even manages to see the light of day, which I highly doubt it will.

            Not to mention the fact that Marvel hasn’t had a truly successful Network TV show, since the Incredible Hulk, and that was in nearly 40 yeas ago. (Ironically enough, Marvel has had more success with that TV show, than they have had with both their movies. But I digress…)

            Regarding the Netflix stuff though, I think it’s a bit disingenuous for people to count that as regular TV, since those series you named are basically glorified 13-hour movies. That’s how they are produced, and that’s how they are presented. And regardless, and at any rate, that Netflix stuff is hardly being considered as “mastering TV content”, when A) the viewership numbers for those “series” are rather mediocre at best, and B) each series only seems to air once a year. You need to do more than one show a year, in order to become a “master”.

            So all of that to say, no company is a complete success at everything. I can acknowledge that Marvel has built its empire around it’s movies, and this is an area even I begrudgingly admit that this is an area that DC is still trying to develop that medium, and they have a bit of ways to go, before they are viewed as being comparable to Marvel in that regard. But people really should be honest about Marvel’s failings as well, even when it pains them to do the same.

          • Axxell

            Is that so? Well, perhaps if they’d done more marketing for Ant-Man, it wouldn’t have flopped.

            Ant-Man is only a flop by MCU standards. And considering how many more billion dollar makers Marvel has over any other franchise, I’d say the claim still stands.

            I don’t know that “we all know that”. In fact, DC showcases pilot eps for most of their DCTV content, and each of them has opened to huge numbers. Also, They showcase all of their animated movies each year, and they each end up being high sellers.

            Sure DC does OK with their shows and films, but they really aren’t breaking any records like Marvel is with movies. Marvel Studios itself has fallen at times for the trap of spoiling their movies ahead of release, but they’re much better at it than WB. And it shows in the way audiences react to their movies.

            LMAO at this. They’ve been setting a “strategy” for nearly a decade, and with the exception of movies, very little of that has panned out.

            Not…really? I mean, they only started seriously producing TV content based on their franchise about 4 years ago. On that front, their title library keeps growing larger…and we’re talking quality content. Only one show has been cancelled since, and they made that last 2 seasons; Jessica Jones won a Peabody Award for recognition of it’s thematic depth. I’d say it’s “panned out” better than the rest.

            Disney has all but shut down any/all video game studios for nearly all its franchises (Marvel, Star Wars, etc). Even the author of a recent Rolling Stone article spoke on it, during his coverage of Injustice 2:

            http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/news/injustice-2-dc-comics-coo-ed-boon-reveal-game-secrets-20160608

            Like I said, they’ve only seemed to focus on movies and TV. They’ve never developed their own videogames.

            Ever since Disney bought Star Wars, there hasn’t been a decent game, and the games have been coming out less and less frequently. Whereas, prior to Disney, Lucasfilm released a SW game not only a couple of times a year, but they were on a variety of platforms, and they were mostly bestsellers.

            I guess you missed the news about Star Wars Battlefront?

            Star Wars Battlefront debuted at number one in the UK for retail non-digital sales according to Chart-Track in its first week of release, and became the fourth fastest-selling title released in 2015. It marked the biggest launch of a video game in the Star Wars franchise, and exceeded the sales of Star Wars: The Force Unleashed, the previous record holder, by 117%. It was also the fastest-selling online PlayStation 4 video game, breaking the record previously held by Destiny.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars_Battlefront_(2015_video_game)#Reception

            LOL at “peppering”, though. I’d actually assert that what DC doing, instead of “peppering”, is giving people a full course meal of multimedia entertainment. Everywhere else Marvel fails, DC succeeds. And, whereas movies is pretty much all that Marvel is consistently offering, that could be looked at as the dessert to the meal.

            DC has been consistently offering multimedia product since the 30’s. Every decade since, they’ve presented long standing product on radio, TV (live and animation), and in a plethora of other forms, while Marvel has struggled.

            Eh, I don’t know about that “full course meal” analogy…if anything, movies and TV is where Marvel and DC make their bread and butter, so I’d say THAT is the main course, if anything. Not everyone who watches TV or movies plays videogames or reads comics, so that’d be more akin to dessert.

            First, LMAO at “masters of TV content”. I know you like to think that Disney lumping their Marvel content on Netflix is some sort of “win”, but the numbers don’t support that. Also, Marvel has failed at actual TV content.

            As you well know (but for some reason, have opted not to mention here), AoShit’s ratings have bottomed out. All their other TV projects have either been cancelled, or shut down in pre-production. It’s funny that you mention Damage Control, since at this point, DC is the first to launch that very same concept, and it will only look like Marvel is trying to copy DC in that regard. That’s if it even manages to see the light of day, which I highly doubt it will.

            Not to mention the fact that Marvel hasn’t had a truly successful Network TV show, since the Incredible Hulk, and that was in nearly 40 yeas ago. (Ironically enough, Marvel has had more success with that TV show, than they have had with both their movies. But I digress…)

            Regarding the Netflix stuff though, I think it’s a bit disingenuous for people to count that as regular TV, since those series you named are basically glorified 13-hour movies. That’s how they are produced, and that’s how they are presented. And regardless, and at any rate, that Netflix stuff is hardly being considered as “mastering TV content”, when A) the viewership numbers for those “series” are rather mediocre at best, and B) each series only seems to air once a year. You need to do more than one show a year, in order to become a “master”.

            I see you still keep ragging on and thrashing Agents of SHIELD, yet the show is still in the air, even when you claim how bad it is. And yes, other Marvel shows have been cancelled in pre-production…like many more DC shows have been cancelled. At least the only show that was cancelled after it’s series premier lasted longer than DC’s one cancellation. And you know damn well that if CW hadn’t been forced to take ANOTHER superhero show (after they said they wouldn’t), Supergirl would’ve been next.

            It’s kinda disingenuous for you to try separating the Netflix content from “Network TV” as “not really TV content”…you call it “13-hour movies” when in reality you can say the same about any TV season of any show, including the ones from DC. The only difference is the instant availability of Netflix. The Academy of Television Arts & Sciences doesn’t see a difference, so your argument has no weight.

            Your “Divide and conquer” strategy is pretty obvious since Marvel has produced their best stuff on Netflix. You want to claim the viewership numbers for the series are weak, without having any hard numbers to back it up; if anything, experts have consistently said that those shows have been rating hits. Why else would Netflix keep asking for more, even when they originally said they’d only release 4 of them per year? (By the way, they’ve already met your arbitrary bar by releasing more than one show a year…).

            All in all, Marvel’s strategy hasn’t been perfect, but it damn near is wherever they succeed.

          • SAMURAI36

            Ant-Man is only a flop by MCU standards.

            If that’s the case, then everything is a flop by “MCU Standards”. But the reality is, Ant-Man did not do well by industry standards, especially considering the next point you tried to cover this up with:

            And considering how many more billion dollar makers Marvel has over any other franchise, I’d say the claim still stands.

            Beside the point. Having a slew of successes does not negate one failure. Nor does it create a reason to ignore that failure. Ant-Man failed, likely due to lack of marketing. In all honesty, I can’t use the fact that it wasn’t a good film as a reason for its failure, since I don’t think most of Marvel’s films are very good, but that doesn’t negate their success.

            Sure DC does OK with their shows and films, but they really aren’t breaking any records like Marvel is with movies.

            How does one genuinely compare movies to TV? Especially given the arguments that you made later on?

            DC is doing far more than “okay” with TV. Not sure why you’re trying to downplay their accomplishments, but no other comic book related franchise has even come close to accomplishing with DC has, in terms of live action TV. And that includes past and present.

            DC currently has content on network TV 5 nights a week currently, and sometimes 2 and 3 times a night. And it’s spread across several network outlets.

            They currently have 8 shows on the air right now, with nearly as many on the way.

            It’s dishonest and disingenuous to not acknowledge this as a major accomplishment, especially when their competitors have not, and cannot come close to that.

            Marvel Studios itself has fallen at times for the trap of spoiling their movies ahead of release, but they’re much better at it than WB. And it shows in the way audiences react to their movies.

            Again, not the point. None of what you’re saying is relevant to the original discussion. It’s not that Marvel doesn’t want to do events, otherwise they wouldn’t attempt to do them at D23.

            But last year’s D23 was extremely lackluster. Now, if your point is that they do well with their films despite their marketing, that’s another issue entirely.

            Not…really? I mean, they only started seriously producing TV content based on their franchise about 4 years ago.

            Marvel has been attempting to produce TV content for decades. This is only the first, real, semi-successful attempt at it.

            On that front, their title library keeps growing larger…and we’re talking quality content. Only one show has been canceled since, and they made that last 2 seasons; Jessica Jones won a Peabody Award for recognition of it’s thematic depth. I’d say it’s “panned out” better than the rest.

            Again, you’re not being totally honest; ABC has pulled the plug on future prospects for Marvel shows. The network doesn’t believe in Marvel’s content. And this is something that’s already been reported here, as well as other sites, so I’m not sure why you’re trying to turn a blind eye to it.

            While it may seem like Marvel has gotten over the TV hurdle, but they really haven’t. (I’ll describe this in further detail in my next post)

            Like I said, they’ve only seemed to focus on movies and TV. They’ve never developed their own videogames.

            It’s funny, that the one recent Marvel video game that was remotely successful (Marvel Lego) was produced by WB. Perhaps Marvel should revert the video game rights back to WB, LOL.

            I guess you missed the news about Star Wars Battlefront?

            I didn’t miss it, just like I didn’t miss the fact that it sold well, based on being marketed alongside the release of SW:TFA.

            Plus, the ratings for the game were only “okay” (to use your term). 7 out of 10 isn’t breaking any records, especially from a franchise that is used to putting out 9+ out of 10 games.

            And that doesn’t change the fact that this is ONE game, released after a few years.

            Eh, I don’t know about that “full course meal” analogy…if anything, movies and TV is where Marvel and DC make their bread and butter, so I’d say THAT is the main course, if anything.

            Unless you eat only 2 or 3 times a year, then that’s a false equivalent. I’m not talking about the companies feeding themselves, I’m talking about them feeding their respective audiences.

            DC is feeding their audience almost daily, weekly, monthly, and quarterly.

            Marvel attempts to feed their audience weekly, but it’s a relatively weak constitution. No one is getting a fat belly off of AoShit or Agent Carter. Other than that, they are feeding their audience once a year, with their 13-hour movies (more on that later), and a couple of times a year with their movies.

            As it stands, audiences have to wait a few years at times, just to get the continuation of the serial story of any one character. Therefore, even though Black Panther made admittedly a great intro in what was otherwise a silly movie, it will be yet another 3 years before we even see him again.

            Meanwhile, we see DC characters on a regular basis, and don’t have to wait for the icing on the cake (movies) in order to see them.

            Not everyone who watches TV or movies plays videogames or reads comics, so that’d be more akin to dessert.

            You don’t seem to be all that informed about this stuff. You could make that argument for comics, which is indeed a niche market, but to say the same for gaming is complete folly.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_game_consoles#Home_game_consoles

            http://www.statista.com/statistics/276768/global-unit-sales-of-video-game-consoles/

            And this is not even to speak of each game, which costs upwards of $60+ (factoring in purchased DLC, monthly subscriptions for consoles and games, etc), and the average gamer has anywhere between 4 and 10 different games. And that’s not to speak of all the tournaments on a local, regional, national, and worldwide level.

            I could speak exhaustively about this particular topic, because I am something of a part time gamer. But the point is, that’s an awful lot of money that Marvel is leaving on the table, and WB/DC continues to scoop up, each and every year.

            More people own a gaming console of some sort (and that’s not even factoring in PC gaming), than subscribe to Netflix.

            So all of that to say, video games are far from “dessert”. More hours get logged playing video games, than watching TV and movies combined.

            I see you still keep ragging on and thrashing Agents of SHIELD, yet the show is still in the air, even when you claim how bad it is.

            That’s because it is bad. It’s funny, how you want to use ratings when it suits your point, but never when it applies to Marvel. It’s either “it’s good because it made alot of money”, or “it’s good because the ratings are high”. That always seems to be Marvel fans’ get out of jail card.

            However, in the case of AoShit, neither excuse applies. It barely stayed on the air, and you know this. In fact, this is yet another conversation we’ve had on the same topic.

            AoShit was on the chopping block more than once since it first aired. Its ratings plummeted numerous times, after a few failed attempts on Marvel and ABC’s parts to boost ratings (cameos, movie tie-ins and such).

            Not to mention, ABC has cancelled shows with better ratings, almost every season. I’ve always asserted that ABC keeps AoShit on the air, in spite of how badly it was doing, because they wanted their own home grown superhero TV show, in order to keep up with what DC was doing on TV. Especially during the time when All Marvel had on TV was AoShit, and DC was expanding their content every season.

            And yes, other Marvel shows have been cancelled in pre-production…like many more DC shows have been cancelled.

            And which “many” shows from DC were those, exactly? Because I only know of one. And only one show got cancelled in pre-production as well.

            Speaking of which:

            At least the only show that was cancelled after it’s series premier lasted longer than DC’s one cancellation.

            Yes, a show that was put on at a bad night and bad time. Vs a show that had the perfect time slot, and was backed by a “Cinematic Universe”.

            Is this really the comparison you want to make?

            Besides, this is no different than your Ant-Man comparison; one failed show (which the character got picked up in other shows), amidst a flurry of successful shows.

            If that show is an example of failure, then so is Ant-Man. You can’t have it both ways.

            And you know damn well that if CW hadn’t been forced to take ANOTHER superhero show (after they said they wouldn’t), Supergirl would’ve been next.

            Actually, I know nothing of the sort, especially since the President of CW has stated (as was reported on this site) that Supergirl always had a home on CW. Besides, the show ended its run with the highest ratings of any Superhero related show(*).

            It’s kinda disingenuous for you to try separating the Netflix content from “Network TV” as “not really TV content”…you call it “13-hour movies” when in reality you can say the same about any TV season of any show, including the ones from DC. The only difference is the instant availability of Netflix. The Academy of Television Arts & Sciences doesn’t see a difference, so your argument has no weight.

            Here’s the problem with that…

            Marvel shoots all these “shows” all at one time, and presents them all at one time. Whereas, network TV doesn’t work that way. Therefore, if a show is bad on Netflix, there’s no way for them to course-correct mid-season, because there is no mid-season.

            You mentioned “binge-watching” in our previous Netflix discussion (which I haven’t forgotten about, BTW), which is how these shows are designed to be watched, so that means you recognize that there’s no way you can treat those shows in the same fashion as you would Network TV.

            Therefore, calling each installment of Daredevil, for example, a “season”, is wholly inaccurate. Shows are called “seasons” because they play thru the winter/spring, or sometimes the summer.

            It would be different if Netflix were to release one ep a week, but they don’t do that.

            Your “Divide and conquer” strategy is pretty obvious since Marvel has produced their best stuff on Netflix. You want to claim the viewership numbers for the series are weak, without having any hard numbers to back it up; if anything, experts have consistently said that those shows have been rating hits. Why else would Netflix keep asking for more, even when they originally said they’d only release 4 of them per year? (By the way, they’ve already met your arbitrary bar by releasing more than one show a year…).

            Please show evidence that they’ve said these shows are “ratings hits”. Please post a link that supports this, with actual numbers.

            I’ll concede that Marvel’s content is high, in comparison to everything else on Netflix, but that’s not really saying much.

            In the meantime, it’s been discussed several times on here, how another company revealed the viewer numbers of these shows, (which was NEVER refuted) and they are around 5M (+/-) viewers. Shows like Gotham and Flash pull those kinds of numbers, and again, without the assistance of a “Cinematic Universe” (which doesn’t seem to be of much help to Marvel TV anyways).

          • Axxell

            If that’s the case, then everything is a flop by “MCU Standards”. But the reality is, Ant-Man did not do well by industry standards

            Ant-Man is in the top 150 highest grossing films, making 60% of BvS’ total on 50% of the budget. It may not have been a hit, but it definitely wasn’t a flop, not by industry standards.

            Beside the point. Having a slew of successes does not negate one failure. Nor does it create a reason to ignore that failure.

            Neither do their failures negate their successes. Marvel hasn’t done everything perfect, but there’s no question they’ve done way better than anyone else, and that was the original point. You want to claim that Marvel’s strategy is bad because Ant-Man didn’t perform as well as they’d have liked, while ignoring that they’ve had many more successes than the competition. Tell me what other franchise has 4 movies reach $1B? How many other can say 3 or more of their movies are in the top 10 highest grossing films in history? None.

            How does one genuinely compare movies to TV? Especially given the arguments that you made later on?

            I wasn’t comparing one to the other; my comment about showing too much content was made in a general sense, movies and TV included; you made it about TV only. You say DC can spoil their content because all their shows have opened with huge numbers, which doesn’t really address the fact that spoilers kill the hype. And as evidence I point to the fact their TV shows haven’t really done anything noteworthy or historic in terms of reception. In fact, you’d be hard pressed to find any DC show with demonstrably better ratings than a Marvel show currently running on TV.

            DC is doing far more than “okay” with TV. Not sure why you’re trying to downplay their accomplishments, but no other comic book related franchise has even come close to accomplishing with DC has, in terms of live action TV. And that includes past and present.

            And exactly what is it they’ve accomplished, according to you? And let’s keep it to their present shows, since after all, we’re talking about how they’re doing now.

            DC currently has content on network TV 5 nights a week currently, and sometimes 2 and 3 times a night. And it’s spread across several network outlets.

            They currently have 8 shows on the air right now, with nearly as many on the way.

            It’s dishonest and disingenuous to not acknowledge this as a major accomplishment, especially when their competitors have not, and cannot come close to that.

            And how many of those are really quality TV? Because it seems like they’re having a hard time getting anyone to buy into it…they’ve tried to hawk their shows on other networks since even the CW is admittedly on a glut of DC series, yet twice have they had their shows dumped back at their door. Sure it’s a great effort to try and push as many shows as possible on as many networks as possible, but more important than that is the quality and staying power of the concept.

            Again, not the point. None of what you’re saying is relevant to the original discussion. It’s not that Marvel doesn’t want to do events, otherwise they wouldn’t attempt to do them at D23.

            But last year’s D23 was extremely lackluster. Now, if your point is that they do well with their films despite their marketing, that’s another issue entirely.

            If D23 was lackluster, it was because they had little to spoil. They really didn’t show anything new in regards to the MCU, which admittedly makes for a boring expo, but as I said, matches with the plan of spoiling as little as possible.

            Marvel has been attempting to produce TV content for decades. This is only the first, real, semi-successful attempt at it.

            That’s because it was only 4 years ago that they gained the financial capacity to fund their own projects…you can’t blame them for not delivering something they had no control over.

            Again, you’re not being totally honest; ABC has pulled the plug on future prospects for Marvel shows. The network doesn’t believe in Marvel’s content. And this is something that’s already been reported here, as well as other sites, so I’m not sure why you’re trying to turn a blind eye to it.

            Remind me what is your excuse for Agents of SHIELD still being on the air? If anyone’s being dishonest it’s you, trying to claim that because ABC bounced around an idea and later decided not to go ahead with it, then it means they don’t believe in Marvel content.

            It’s funny, that the one recent Marvel video game that was remotely successful (Marvel Lego) was produced by WB. Perhaps Marvel should revert the video game rights back to WB, LOL.

            I just find it funny that WB wants to produce Marvel content at all…you’d think they’d be happy with the DC franchise, but I guess that’s not enough…

            I didn’t miss it, just like I didn’t miss the fact that it sold well, based on being marketed alongside the release of SW:TFA.

            Plus, the ratings for the game were only “okay” (to use your term). 7 out of 10 isn’t breaking any records, especially from a franchise that is used to putting out 9+ out of 10 games.

            I guess Marvel Lego is also only OK…not the success you claim it to be?

            Unless you eat only 2 or 3 times a year, then that’s a false equivalent. I’m not talking about the companies feeding themselves, I’m talking about them feeding their respective audiences.

            DC is feeding their audience almost daily, weekly, monthly, and quarterly.

            I guess that is because, like a daily meal, it is ingested in less than 30 min and forgotten about, which requires a daily serving…

            You don’t seem to be all that informed about this stuff. You could make that argument for comics, which is indeed a niche market, but to say the same for gaming is complete folly.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/

            http://www.statista.com/statis

            And this is not even to speak of each game, which costs upwards of $60+ (factoring in purchased DLC, monthly subscriptions for consoles and games, etc), and the average gamer has anywhere between 4 and 10 different games. And that’s not to speak of all the tournaments on a local, regional, national, and worldwide level.

            I could speak exhaustively about this particular topic, because I am something of a part time gamer. But the point is, that’s an awful lot of money that Marvel is leaving on the table, and WB/DC continues to scoop up, each and every year.

            More people own a gaming console of some sort (and that’s not even factoring in PC gaming), than subscribe to Netflix.

            So all of that to say, video games are far from “dessert”. More hours get logged playing video games, than watching TV and movies combined.

            None of which belies the fact that not everyone plays videogames. That’s why I said to most people, it’s dessert. There’s VERY few games that don’t also watch movies.

            That’s because it is bad. It’s funny, how you want to use ratings when it suits your point, but never when it applies to Marvel. It’s either “it’s good because it made alot of money”, or “it’s good because the ratings are high”. That always seems to be Marvel fans’ get out of jail card.

            No…I’n precisely using ratings when it applies to Marvel. Show me another DC series with better ratings than Agents of SHIELD. I’ll wait.

            However, in the case of AoShit, neither excuse applies. It barely stayed on the air, and you know this. In fact, this is yet another conversation we’ve had on the same topic.

            AoShit was on the chopping block more than once since it first aired. Its ratings plummeted numerous times, after a few failed attempts on Marvel and ABC’s parts to boost ratings (cameos, movie tie-ins and such).

            Not to mention, ABC has cancelled shows with better ratings, almost every season. I’ve always asserted that ABC keeps AoShit on the air, in spite of how badly it was doing, because they wanted their own home grown superhero TV show, in order to keep up with what DC was doing on TV. Especially during the time when All Marvel had on TV was AoShit, and DC was expanding their content every season.

            Since there’s no such show on ABC, your point is invalid. Like I said, point me a DC series with better ratings than any Marvel show.

            And which “many” shows from DC were those, exactly? Because I only know of one. And only one show got cancelled in pre-production as well.

            Just off the top of my head, Wonder Woman and Aquaman, aside from the one you already know about, as well as others I don’t care enought to remember.

            Yes, a show that was put on at a bad night and bad time. Vs a show that had the perfect time slot, and was backed by a “Cinematic Universe”.

            Is this really the comparison you want to make?

            I thought you said being part of a cinematic universe was no benefit? Anyhow, that’s a pretty lame excuse. If the show were any good, I’m sure they could’ve found someone willing to put it on a prime slot…the fact they couldn’t is very telling.

            Besides, this is no different than your Ant-Man comparison; one failed show (which the character got picked up in other shows), amidst a flurry of successful shows.

            If that show is an example of failure, then so is Ant-Man. You can’t have it both ways.

            Except…where is this “flurry of successful shows”? I see a bunch of shows that are doing OK, but none of them are doing anything extraordinary like Marvel can be said is doing in the context of the Ant-Man comparison. So, no…those are totally different scenarios.

            Actually, I know nothing of the sort, especially since the President of CW has stated (as was reported on this site) that Supergirl always had a home on CW. Besides, the show ended its run with the highest ratings of any Superhero related show(*).

            But we all know that’s not a literal statement; CBS dropped the series. Don’t start feigning ignorance like that didn’t just happen.

            Here’s the problem with that…

            Marvel shoots all these “shows” all at one time, and presents them all at one time. Whereas, network TV doesn’t work that way. Therefore, if a show is bad on Netflix, there’s no way for them to course-correct mid-season, because there is no mid-season.

            You mentioned “binge-watching” in our previous Netflix discussion (which I haven’t forgotten about, BTW), which is how these shows are designed to be watched, so that means you recognize that there’s no way you can treat those shows in the same fashion as you would Network TV.

            Therefore, calling each installment of Daredevil, for example, a “season”, is wholly inaccurate. Shows are called “seasons” because they play thru the winter/spring, or sometimes the summer.

            It would be different if Netflix were to release one ep a week, but they don’t do that.

            You’re relying on semantics and logic twists to dismiss Marvel’s most powerful and successful series. Like I said, ATAS still considers them TV shows, so your argument is invalid. You’re only grasping at straws.

            Please show evidence that they’ve said these shows are “ratings hits”. Please post a link that supports this, with actual numbers.

            To wit:

            Data gathered from a sample of 15,000 users, by San Francisco tech firm Symphony, paints Jessica Jones as an especially strong player for the streamer. Based on audio recognition data, covering the months of September, October, November and December, a slide showed that an average 4.8 million viewers in the adults 18-49 group watched an episode of the Marvel drama. (The demographic, it should be noted, likely doesn’t matter very much to Netflix on account of the absence of advertising.)

            http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/nbc-exec-outs-netflix-ratings-855642

            Later comments by Netflix themselves suggest it could be even higher. DC’s highest rated series (Gotham) only averages 4.09m…

            But w/e…you want to have it both ways. You want to disparage Marvel’s strategy by claiming a cinematic universe doesn’t help the shows, but when they’re clearly proven to be performing better, it’s your go to excuse…

          • SAMURAI36

            Ant-Man is in the top 150 highest grossing films, making 60% of BvS’ total on 50% of the budget. It may not have been a hit, but it definitely wasn’t a flop, not by industry standards.

            I like how you like to try to put lipstick on a pig, and try to sell it as a woman.

            Ant-Man made $500M. For a high budget summer blockbuster film, that’s bad. The film had no buzz, and definitely underperformed.

            But feel free to keep believing that narrative you are trying to sell.

            Neither do their failures negate their successes.

            Nobody is implying otherwise, but it becomes increasingly dishonest, when Marvel fans won’t acknowledge Marvel’s failures, and instead deflect them with mentioning Marvel’s successes, which are obvious. But their failures are not obvious, and that’s not because they don’t have them. They’ve got plenty of them.

            Marvel hasn’t done everything perfect, but there’s no question they’ve done way better than anyone else, and that was the original point.

            No, that was your point. It was never mine.

            And I re-iterate: the only thing Marvel has done extremely well, is movies. THAT’S REALLY IT. Everything else, they’ve either handled in a mediocre fashion, or not at all.

            –Live TV

            –Animation (which you STILL won’t so much as acknowlege, despite me bringing it up several times already)

            –Video Games

            –And I’m going to mention comics here as well. I could go on a diatribe about it, but I want you to foul up with a nonsensical argument, like you’ve done with Marvel TV, and make my point for me.

            –Merchandising

            That’s 5 critical sections that Marvel suffers, in one fashion or another.

            But you seem to think that just because they do one thing relatively well, that it excuses the 5 other things they don’t.

            You want to claim that Marvel’s strategy is bad because Ant-Man didn’t perform as well as they’d have liked, while ignoring that they’ve had many more successes than the competition. Tell me what other franchise has 4 movies reach $1B? How many other can say 3 or more of their movies are in the top 10 highest grossing films in history? None.

            And once again, we are right back to movies. That’s your only retort. I have no qualms about Marvel’s films doing well (despite many of them not being very good), but that’s your little safety zone.

            This discussion began with talking about multi-media. MULTI = more than one. Movies is just one aspect of it. And I know you realize this, but you’re just feigning ignorance at this point.

            I wasn’t comparing one to the other; my comment about showing too much content was made in a general sense, movies and TV included; you made it about TV only.

            No I didn’t; I’ve been talking about all aspects this entire time. You’ve said nothing about TV, in terms of marketing. Once again, you default to movies, because that’s your shield as it pertains to Marvel.

            You say DC can spoil their content because all their shows have opened with huge numbers, which doesn’t really address the fact that spoilers kill the hype.

            Prove it. Prove what you’re saying, or GTFO. Because I can prove precisely the opposite, when it comes to DC’s multimedia content. There is so much proof out there about this, that it’s not even funny. But I want you to put your money where your mouth is.

            And as evidence I point to the fact their TV shows haven’t really done anything noteworthy or historic in terms of reception. In fact, you’d be hard pressed to find any DC show with demonstrably better ratings than the top running Marvel shows.

            I’ve already shown this in my other response to you, which you’ve yet to respond to. And I know you read it. Nothing you’re saying adds up.

            But I think it’s funny, when you say “DCTV shows haven’t really done anything……”, when they’ve A) been renewed several times, B) most of them have won several awards, and C) they keep expanding their content.

            But it’s funny how you think that argument works in your favor against DC, but not against Marvel. Because precisely the same thing can be said about the “top running Marvel shows”.

            And exactly what is it they’ve accomplished, according to you? And let’s keep it to their present shows, since after all, we’re talking about how they’re doing now.

            See above.

            And how many of those are really quality TV?

            Yet another disingenuous argument. You pick and choose what you want to use as the standard, when the same arguments can be made about most of Marvel’s output (TV and movie).

            You mention Marvel being in the $1B movie club, but what you don’t mention, is the fact that most of Marvel’s output is mediocre, financially. And even some of those $1B darlings have been panned. Precious few people think IM3 was a particularly great film. Same with AOU. And most of Phase 1 isn’t highly praised either.

            And yet again, I say that Marvel’s Netflix material has a mediocre viewership. They are NOT breaking any records, and for that matter, Netflix isn’t a place for anyone to break records anyway.

            Because it seems like they’re having a hard time getting anyone to buy into it…they’ve tried to hawk their shows on other networks since even the CW is admittedly on a glut of DC series, yet twice have they had their shows dumped back at their door.

            As per usual, you have no clue what you’re talking about. WB/DC’s plan was always to put more material on other networks. Because that’s what WB already does. They are responsible for 30+% of all programming on TV.

            50% of their programming is going into it’s 3rd+ season. And only 50% of their programming is on the same network, BTW.

            Sure it’s a great effort to try and push as many shows as possible on as many networks as possible, but more important than that is the quality and staying power of the concept.

            And yet, DC is retaining viewers, winning awards, getting their products renewed, and adding more content.

            Oh, and let’s not forget, that DC currently has the longest running comic based TV shows of all time. No one has touched Smallville’s 10 years. The only one coming close, is Walking Dead.

            If D23 was lackluster, it was because they had little to spoil. They really didn’t show anything new in regards to the MCU, which admittedly makes for a boring expo, but as I said, matches with the plan of spoiling as little as possible.

            Not wanting to spoil content, and not having content to spoil are two completely mutually exclusive notions. Not sure why you’re even trying to sell that as a narrative. But at least you can admit that D23 has been lackluster.

            That’s because it was only 4 years ago that they gained the financial capacity to fund their own projects…you can’t blame them for not delivering something they had no control over.

            I can very well blame them, when they still had creative input on many of these products. When you look at products like “Mutant X”, and see the names they had on the production list, those names hearken right back to Marvel. Same as with the pre-MCU films.

            People like to use that as an excuse, but whether you like it or not, it was Marvel’s people that were responsible for, and/or involved with all those failed projects.

            I just find it funny that WB wants to produce Marvel content at all…you’d think they’d be happy with the DC franchise, but I guess that’s not enough…

            I guess Marvel Lego is also only OK…not the success you claim it to be?

            There you go, being disingenuous again.

            Marvel Lego go decent ratings, but that had nothing to do with Marvel, whatsoever.

            But get something straight, while you’re trying your hardest to throw darts at DC: Marvel came to WB to make that game for them, not vice versa.

            You should be thankful for WB for doing Marvel that solid. Otherwise, you wouldn’t even have that as a video game.

            No…I’n precisely using ratings when it applies to Marvel.

            Which ratings are those? I’d like to see the ones that are miraculously different from the ones I posted. Because you don’t get to say “Marvel’s ratings are good”, but somehow DC’s “aren’t that great”, when DC’s ratings outrank Marvel’s.

            I guess that is because, like a daily meal, it is ingested in less than 30 min and forgotten about, which requires a daily serving…

            Wow, that sounds incredibly stupid. All meals require a “daily serving”, genius.

            But since you wanna talk about things that have been completely forgotten about, let’s talk about how people are not talking about 90% of those MCU films you love to brag about.

            AOU came and went, and nobody is discussing it. Check social media, or any of the comics-related websites. For that matter, check those same outlets for discussion about Silly War. Aside from talking about how it made $1B, nobody’s talking about that either.

            The only Marvel films that garner real discussion, are GOTG, TWS, and the first Avengers film. That’s because 90% of the MCU is forgettable. These are popcorn flicks, plain and simple.

            None of which belies the fact that not everyone plays videogames. That’s why I said to most people, it’s dessert. There’s VERY few gamers that don’t also watch movies.

            You’re just talking nonsense, while trying your hardest to conflate several disparate points together.

            Once again, gaming is a MASSIVE industry, and Marvel has virtually no presence in it. It’s not about “everybody”, which is a dumb argument to even attempt to make. And “not everyone” in the world owns a TV or a cell phone either, but that doesn’t negate the fact that cell phones and TV’s are a huge industry.

            Just own up to the fact that Marvel has, and is perpetually missing the boat when it comes to this medium. Because it’s true, whether you admit to it or not. But admitting it, rather than trying to downplay it, would make you look at least a little more honest.

            Since there’s no such show on ABC, your point is invalid. Like I said, point me a standing DC series with better viewership than the top running Marvel shows.

            I’ve already done that. But so, is this you admitting that AoShit is a fail?

            Just off the top of my head, Wonder Woman and Aquaman, aside from the one you already know about, as well as others I don’t care enough to remember.

            Since you can’t remember, then they don’t exist. But WW and Aquaman are now getting movies, so based on your logic, that’s an upgrade, not a fail.

            But in terms of successful DC content, I can name content dating back to the 40’s. You can’t do the same for Marvel, by any stretch. As I said previously, the longest running Marvel TV show was the Hulk, and that was almost 40 years ago. That’s what a successful Marvel TV show looked like.

            Talk to me in 5 years, when Marvel has a TV show (and NOT a 13-hour movie) that’s been on for several seasons, and receives good to great ratings.

            I thought you said being part of a cinematic universe was no benefit? Anyhow, that’s a pretty lame excuse. If the show were any good, I’m sure they could’ve found someone willing to put it on a prime slot…the fact they couldn’t is very telling.

            So, this is you feigning stupid again? I said nothing of the sort. Once again, your show, AoShit is FAILING, despite having the backup of a massive movie universe behind it.

            Meanwhile, Constantine had nothing of the sort. Despite having a film that admittedly didn’t do well, Constantine didn’t have much of a presence. And who was the “someone” that was supposed to put them on a better time slot? You do realize that WB does not own NBC, yes?

            And the only metric for shows being good, are the ratings, genius. If the show can’t get numbers, there will be no reason to keep it.

            You’re relying on semantics and logic twists to dismiss Marvel’s most powerful and successful series.

            You’ve got some nerve, coming from the king of it. But you can’t disprove any of what I’d said, and until you do, it still stands as valid.

            Like I said, ATAS still considers them TV shows, so your argument is invalid. You’re only grasping at straws.

            Prove it. Links? I hope you don’t think I’m dumb enough to believe anything you said, when I’ve caught you in several lies, up to and including this very discussion.

            Speaking of which:

            To wit:

            Data gathered from a sample of 15,000 users, by San Francisco tech firm Symphony, paints Jessica Jones as an especially strong player for the streamer. Based on audio recognition data, covering the months of September, October, November and December, a slide showed that an average 4.8 million viewers in the adults 18-49 group watched an episode of the Marvel drama. (The demographic, it should be noted, likely doesn’t matter very much to Netflix on account of the absence of advertising.)

            http://www.hollywoodreporter.c

            Later comments by Netflix themselves suggest it could be even higher. DC’s highest rated series (Gotham) only averages 4.09m…

            I see you didn’t post those “suggestions” from Netflix. And once again, I’ve posted Dc’s numbers. Supergirl’s numbers nearly double those Netflix numbers.

            But regardless, if these Netflix shows are so good, then why are their numbers so mediocre? You’ve got a Cinematic Universe (that they don’t truly even belong to, but whatevs), and they’ve got supposedly great story. Yet, their numbers are about the same as DCTV’s “mediocre” numbers.

            To pose your own Q’s back at you, how do you justify these TV shows doing nothing remarkable?

          • Axxell

            I like how you like to try to put lipstick on a pig, and try to sell it as a woman.

            Ant-Man made $500M. For a high budget summer blockbuster film, that’s bad. The film had no buzz, and definitely underperformed.

            But feel free to keep believing that narrative you are trying to sell.

            Yeah, that’s why they made room on the schedule for a sequel…it did soo bad that the director and producers were brought back for a second helping…because Disney just looooves not making money, right?

            Nobody is implying otherwise, but it becomes increasingly dishonest, when Marvel fans won’t acknowledge Marvel’s failures, and instead deflect them with mentioning Marvel’s successes, which are obvious. But their failures are not obvious, and that’s not because they don’t have them. They’ve got plenty of them.

            What’s really dishonest is you trying to throw mud when someone points out that Marvel has developed a successful formula. That’s how this whole argument started, because you can’t take it when someone praises Marvel.

            No, that was your point. It was never mine.

            Of course it wasn’t…your point was that Marvel is a failure because they lost a subjective battle at an event they didn’t care enough to attend last year. Guess how much “winning SDCC” helped BvS?…Exactly.

            And I re-iterate: the only thing Marvel has done extremely well, is movies. THAT’S REALLY IT. Everything else, they’ve either handled in a mediocre fashion, or not at all.

            –Live TV

            –Animation (which you STILL won’t so much as acknowlege, despite me bringing it up several times already)

            –Video Games

            –And I’m going to mention comics here as well. I could go on a diatribe about it, but I want you to foul up with a nonsensical argument, like you’ve done with Marvel TV, and make my point for me.

            –Merchandising

            That’s 5 critical sections that Marvel suffers, in one fashion or another.

            LOL! I hope you didn’t fry your brain trying to think of new “sections” where Marvel supposedly fails, like…”Merchandising”…seriously? LMAO!…And comics? Yeah, you want me to “foul up”…by posting the market trend in comics sales of the past couple of years? Yeah, that’d be a huge faux pas…

            http://www.theouthousers.com/index.php/news/135554-dc-sells-235k-copies-of-rebirth-still-loses-big-to-marvel.html

            Seems to me like Marvel still outsells DC this month…like every month. Big surprise…looking forward to you saying I made your point for you, so you can get out from having to explain how DC wins this one…

            I’ll give you animation…but not 3D animation, just regular. And stop motion is still up for grabs…

            But seriously, with live TV, DC isn’t doing anything more special than Marvel; they’re just throwing $#!+ at the wall and hoping it sticks, not to mention ripping Marvel’s pages on crossover titles. 2 of their shows in the last 5 years have been orphaned, with at least 2 more that SHOULD be. DC has NOTHING that touches Daredevil or Jessica Jones. If that’s mediocre, then DC has handled their shows in a nauseating fashion.

            And once again, we are right back to movies. That’s your only retort. I have no qualms about Marvel’s films doing well (despite many of them not being very good), but that’s your little safety zone.

            This discussion began with talking about multi-media. MULTI = more than one. Movies is just one aspect of it. And I know you realize this, but you’re just feigning ignorance at this point.

            You were the one to bring up Ant-Man, which is a movie. That’s what you do when you’re keeping things in subject…you talk about that. You only want to talk about the Ant-Man movie so you can paint Marvel as a failure, without talking about the other movies they’ve done…how convenient.

            No I didn’t; I’ve been talking about all aspects this entire time. You’ve said nothing about TV, in terms of marketing. Once again, you default to movies, because that’s your shield as it pertains to Marvel.

            What is there to talk about “TV, in terms of marketing”? Now you wanna twist this into a “marketing” conversation since you know full well Marvel is every bit DC’s equal in the quality aspect? Is “marketing” your “shield” now?

            Prove it. Prove what you’re saying, or GTFO. Because I can prove precisely the opposite, when it comes to DC’s multimedia content. There is so much proof out there about this, that it’s not even funny. But I want you to put your money where your mouth is.

            This doesn’t even merit a response…you want proof that water is wet too?

            I’ve already shown this in my other response to you, which you’ve yet to respond to. And I know you read it. Nothing you’re saying adds up.

            Not really…All you did was take the focus away from the fact Marvel’s shows for the most part have done well…Agents of SHIELD is on it’s 3rd season, and everyone knows Daredevil and Jessica Jones are hits, and you can’t even deny that.

            But I think it’s funny, when you say “DCTV shows haven’t really done anything……”, when they’ve A) been renewed several times, B) most of them have won several awards, and C) they keep expanding their content.

            So what? Marvel shows have achieved the same…only difference is they’re popular enough that they haven’t been dropped twice in the last 5 years.

            But it’s funny how you think that argument works in your favor against DC, but not against Marvel. Because precisely the same thing can be said about the “top running Marvel shows”.

            You’re the one claiming DC has the upper hand in TV; I only have to prove that Marvel is doing well enough to compete, which is what I’ve been saying from the beginning. Why don’t you give me proof that DC has been SUPERIOR, given how Marvel hasn’t had as many cancellations as them, and has been awarded multiple times for their shows as well?

            Yet another disingenuous argument. You pick and choose what you want to use as the standard, when the same arguments can be made about most of Marvel’s output (TV and movie).

            You mention Marvel being in the $1B movie club, but what you don’t mention, is the fact that most of Marvel’s output is mediocre, financially.

            Marvel is “mediocre, financially”?

            And you wonder why people think you’re a fanboy…

            And even some of those $1B darlings have been panned. Precious few people think IM3 was a particularly great film. Same with AOU. And most of Phase 1 isn’t highly praised either.

            At least I can forgive a studio that only started making their own movies less than 10 years ago…WB/DC has been at it for almost half a century, and all they have to show for it is a bunch of Batman/Superman films at various degrees of quality, along with a couple of mediocre one-offs.

            And yet again, I say that Marvel’s Netflix material has a mediocre viewership. They are NOT breaking any records, and for that matter, Netflix isn’t a place for anyone to break records anyway.

            Yeah, that’s why Netflix keeps growing and asking for more Marvel shows…

            As per usual, you have no clue what you’re talking about. WB/DC’s plan was always to put more material on other networks. Because that’s what WB already does. They are responsible for 30+% of all programming on TV.

            That’s the problem…WB/DC is trying to do onto TV what Marvel did at the box office…by monopolizing the airwaves with their content to whoever wants to get in on the comic book content craze….Except as seen with Constantine and Supergirl, they’re having a hard time selling it.

            You never denied this in your response, so you know I’m right.

            50% of their programming is going into it’s 3rd+ season. And only 50% of their programming is on the same network, BTW.

            Only because they’re still trying to hawk their wares…they just dumped season 1 of Lucifer and Preacher onto Fox and AMC, and they’re going back to NBC for Powerless. Only a matter of time before one or two get dumped back on WB/DC’s feet, again.

            And yet, DC is retaining viewers, winning awards, getting their products renewed, and adding more content.

            Except for Constantine, which was outright cancelled, and Supergirl which had to be saved (ironically).

            Oh, and let’s not forget, that DC currently has the longest running comic based TV shows of all time. No one has touched Smallville’s 10 years. The only one coming close, is Walking Dead.

            Like I said, you’d have to go way back to find anything of significance in DC TV. The only show outside of CW (where DC shows can’t be unceremoniously dropped) that has stuck around is Gotham.

          • Axxell

            Not wanting to spoil content, and not having content to spoil are two completely mutually exclusive notions. Not sure why you’re even trying to sell that as a narrative. But at least you can admit that D23 has been lackluster.

            If they were as desperate for attention as DC is right now, they might’ve tried to pull some transparent and sad attempt to steal headlines like “leaking” pictures of the entire production process of their films, including at SDCC…but they didn’t need to. The fact AoU was more successful than BvS despite all of DC’s fanfare proved Marvel did it right.

            I can very well blame them, when they still had creative input on many of these products. When you look at products like “Mutant X”, and see the names they had on the production list, those names hearken right back to Marvel. Same as with the pre-MCU films.

            People like to use that as an excuse, but whether you like it or not, it was Marvel’s people that were responsible for, and/or involved with all those failed projects.

            If that’s the case, then I can just as well take all the non-WB, DC licensed content they had a hand in producing, and make them accountable for it…and trust me, there’s plenty more sucky DC content going way back. I’d gladly hold it againt them if that’s the standard you’re gonna use…

            There you go, being disingenuous again.

            Marvel Lego go decent ratings, but that had nothing to do with Marvel, whatsoever.

            Marvel Lego got “OK, nothing special” ratings, by your own standard, so I don’t know why you’re pretending it was more meaningful than a Star Wars game with the same average score…

            But get something straight, while you’re trying your hardest to throw darts at DC: Marvel came to WB to make that game for them, not vice versa.

            You should be thankful for WB for doing Marvel that solid. Otherwise, you wouldn’t even have that as a video game.

            LOL! You’re trying really hard to fool yourself into thinking Lego is such a huge franchise that Marvel somehow needs to go to them for help…

            Let’s get one thing straight…Lego is a licensor. They PAY Marvel to be able to use their characters in their game. If Marvel wanted a game done, they sure as heII don’t need to attach the Lego brand to it, as if their content couldn’t sell without the brand association, so logic right there tells you where each stands.

          • Axxell

            I like how you like to try to put lipstick on a pig, and try to sell it as a woman.

            Ant-Man made $500M. For a high budget summer blockbuster film, that’s bad. The film had no buzz, and definitely underperformed.

            But feel free to keep believing that narrative you are trying to sell.

            Yeah, that’s why they made room on the schedule for a sequel…it did soo bad that the director and producers were brought back for a second helping…because Disney just looooves not making money, right?

            Nobody is implying otherwise, but it becomes increasingly dishonest, when Marvel fans won’t acknowledge Marvel’s failures, and instead deflect them with mentioning Marvel’s successes, which are obvious. But their failures are not obvious, and that’s not because they don’t have them. They’ve got plenty of them.

            What’s really dishonest is you trying to throw mud when someone points out that Marvel has developed a successful formula. That’s how this whole argument started, because you can’t take it when someone praises Marvel.

            No, that was your point. It was never mine.

            Of course it wasn’t…your point was that Marvel is a failure because they lost a subjective battle at an event they didn’t care enough to attend last year. Guess how much “winning SDCC” helped BvS?…Exactly.

            And I re-iterate: the only thing Marvel has done extremely well, is movies. THAT’S REALLY IT. Everything else, they’ve either handled in a mediocre fashion, or not at all.

            –Live TV

            –Animation (which you STILL won’t so much as acknowlege, despite me bringing it up several times already)

            –Video Games

            –And I’m going to mention comics here as well. I could go on a diatribe about it, but I want you to foul up with a nonsensical argument, like you’ve done with Marvel TV, and make my point for me.

            –Merchandising

            That’s 5 critical sections that Marvel suffers, in one fashion or another.

            LOL! I hope you didn’t fry your brain trying to think of new “sections” where Marvel supposedly fails, like…”Merchandising”…seriously? LMAO!…And comics? Yeah, you want me to “foul up”…by posting the market trend in comics sales of the past couple of years? Yeah, that’d be a huge faux pas…

            http://www.theouthousers.com/index.php/news/135554-dc-sells-235k-copies-of-rebirth-still-loses-big-to-marvel.html

            Seems to me like Marvel still outsells DC this month…like every month. Big surprise…looking forward to you saying I made your point for you, so you can get out from having to explain how DC wins this one…

            I’ll give you animation…but not 3D animation, just regular. And stop motion is still up for grabs…

            But seriously, with live TV, DC isn’t doing anything more special than Marvel; they’re just throwing $#!+ at the wall and hoping it sticks, not to mention ripping Marvel’s pages on crossover titles. 2 of their shows in the last 5 years have been orphaned, with at least 2 more that SHOULD be. DC has NOTHING that touches Daredevil or Jessica Jones. If that’s mediocre, then DC has handled their shows in a nauseating fashion.

            And once again, we are right back to movies. That’s your only retort. I have no qualms about Marvel’s films doing well (despite many of them not being very good), but that’s your little safety zone.

            This discussion began with talking about multi-media. MULTI = more than one. Movies is just one aspect of it. And I know you realize this, but you’re just feigning ignorance at this point.

            You were the one to bring up Ant-Man, which is a movie. That’s what you do when you’re keeping things in subject…you talk about that. You only want to talk about the Ant-Man movie so you can paint Marvel as a failure, without talking about the other movies they’ve done…how convenient.

            No I didn’t; I’ve been talking about all aspects this entire time. You’ve said nothing about TV, in terms of marketing. Once again, you default to movies, because that’s your shield as it pertains to Marvel.

            What is there to talk about “TV, in terms of marketing”? Now you wanna twist this into a “marketing” conversation since you know full well Marvel is every bit DC’s equal in the quality aspect? Is “marketing” your “shield” now?

            Prove it. Prove what you’re saying, or GTFO. Because I can prove precisely the opposite, when it comes to DC’s multimedia content. There is so much proof out there about this, that it’s not even funny. But I want you to put your money where your mouth is.

            This doesn’t even merit a response…you want proof that water is wet too?

            I’ve already shown this in my other response to you, which you’ve yet to respond to. And I know you read it. Nothing you’re saying adds up.

            Not really…All you did was take the focus away from the fact Marvel’s shows for the most part have done well…Agents of SHIELD is on it’s 3rd season, and everyone knows Daredevil and Jessica Jones are hits, and you can’t even deny that.

            But I think it’s funny, when you say “DCTV shows haven’t really done anything……”, when they’ve A) been renewed several times, B) most of them have won several awards, and C) they keep expanding their content.

            So what? Marvel shows have achieved the same…only difference is they’re popular enough that they haven’t been dropped twice in the last 5 years.

            But it’s funny how you think that argument works in your favor against DC, but not against Marvel. Because precisely the same thing can be said about the “top running Marvel shows”.

            You’re the one claiming DC has the upper hand in TV; I only have to prove that Marvel is doing well enough to compete, which is what I’ve been saying from the beginning. Why don’t you give me proof that DC has been SUPERIOR, given how Marvel hasn’t had as many cancellations as them, and has been awarded multiple times for their shows as well?

            Yet another disingenuous argument. You pick and choose what you want to use as the standard, when the same arguments can be made about most of Marvel’s output (TV and movie).

            You mention Marvel being in the $1B movie club, but what you don’t mention, is the fact that most of Marvel’s output is mediocre, financially.

            Marvel is “mediocre, financially”?

            And you wonder why people think you’re a fanboy…

            And even some of those $1B darlings have been panned. Precious few people think IM3 was a particularly great film. Same with AOU. And most of Phase 1 isn’t highly praised either.

            At least I can forgive a studio that only started making their own movies less than 10 years ago…WB/DC has been at it for almost half a century, and all they have to show for it is a bunch of Batman/Superman films at various degrees of quality, along with a couple of mediocre one-offs.

            And yet again, I say that Marvel’s Netflix material has a mediocre viewership. They are NOT breaking any records, and for that matter, Netflix isn’t a place for anyone to break records anyway.

            Yeah, that’s why Netflix keeps growing and asking for more Marvel shows…

            As per usual, you have no clue what you’re talking about. WB/DC’s plan was always to put more material on other networks. Because that’s what WB already does. They are responsible for 30+% of all programming on TV.

            That’s the problem…WB/DC is trying to do onto TV what Marvel did at the box office…by monopolizing the airwaves with their content to whoever wants to get in on the comic book content craze….Except as seen with Constantine and Supergirl, they’re having a hard time selling it.

            You never denied this in your response, so you know I’m right.

            50% of their programming is going into it’s 3rd+ season. And only 50% of their programming is on the same network, BTW.

            Only because they’re still trying to hawk their wares…they just dumped season 1 of Lucifer and Preacher onto Fox and AMC, and they’re going back to NBC for Powerless. Only a matter of time before one or two get dumped back on WB/DC’s feet, again.

            And yet, DC is retaining viewers, winning awards, getting their products renewed, and adding more content.

            Except for Constantine, which was outright cancelled, and Supergirl which had to be saved (ironically).

            Oh, and let’s not forget, that DC currently has the longest running comic based TV shows of all time. No one has touched Smallville’s 10 years. The only one coming close, is Walking Dead.

            Like I said, you’d have to go way back to find anything of significance in DC TV. The only show outside of CW (where DC shows can’t be unceremoniously dropped) that has stuck around is Gotham.

            Not wanting to spoil content, and not having content to spoil are two completely mutually exclusive notions. Not sure why you’re even trying to sell that as a narrative. But at least you can admit that D23 has been lackluster.

            If they were as desperate for attention as DC is right now, they might’ve tried to pull some transparent and sad attempt to steal headlines like “leaking” pictures of the entire production process of their films, including at SDCC…but they didn’t need to. The fact AoU was more successful than BvS despite all of DC’s fanfare proved Marvel did it right.

            I can very well blame them, when they still had creative input on many of these products. When you look at products like “Mutant X”, and see the names they had on the production list, those names hearken right back to Marvel. Same as with the pre-MCU films.

            People like to use that as an excuse, but whether you like it or not, it was Marvel’s people that were responsible for, and/or involved with all those failed projects.

            If that’s the case, then I can just as well take all the non-WB, DC licensed content they had a hand in producing, and make them accountable for it…and trust me, there’s plenty more sucky DC content going way back. I’d gladly hold it againt them if that’s the standard you’re gonna use…

            There you go, being disingenuous again.

            Marvel Lego go decent ratings, but that had nothing to do with Marvel, whatsoever.

            Marvel Lego got “OK, nothing special” ratings, by your own standard, so I don’t know why you’re pretending it was more meaningful than a Star Wars game with the same average score…

            But get something straight, while you’re trying your hardest to throw darts at DC: Marvel came to WB to make that game for them, not vice versa.

            You should be thankful for WB for doing Marvel that solid. Otherwise, you wouldn’t even have that as a video game.

            LOL! You’re trying really hard to fool yourself into thinking Lego is such a huge franchise that Marvel somehow needs to go to them for help…

            Let’s get one thing straight…Lego is a licensor. They PAY Marvel to be able to use their characters in their game. If Marvel wanted a game done, they sure as heII don’t need to attach the Lego brand to it, as if their content couldn’t sell without the brand association, so logic right there tells you where each stands.

            Which ratings are those? I’d like to see the ones that are miraculously different from the ones I posted. Because you don’t get to say “Marvel’s ratings are good”, but somehow DC’s “aren’t that great”, when DC’s ratings outrank Marvel’s.

            I already posted their ratings; and like I said, Marvel hasn’t had a single one of their shows cancelled on the first season. DC had 2 shows dropped before Marvel had a single one. DC just throws $#!+ at the wall to see what sticks.

            Wow, that sounds incredibly stupid. All meals require a “daily serving”, genius.

            But since you wanna talk about things that have been completely forgotten about, let’s talk about how people are not talking about 90% of those MCU films you love to brag about.

            AOU came and went, and nobody is discussing it. Check social media, or any of the comics-related websites. For that matter, check those same outlets for discussion about Silly War. Aside from talking about how it made $1B, nobody’s talking about that either.

            The only Marvel films that garner real discussion, are GOTG, TWS, and the first Avengers film. That’s because 90% of the MCU is forgettable. These are popcorn flicks, plain and simple.

            I love how you think that people talking about how $#!++y BvS was, is somehow a better indicator of quality than people PAYING for each Marvel movie…

            Wanna know why people don’t stay talking about ONE single Marvel movie for months? Because the next one is always around the corner. Even with all this “abundance of DC content”, people are still wiping the smell of BvS off their nose, to this day…I guess that means it was great! LOL!

            You’re just talking nonsense, while trying your hardest to conflate several disparate points together.

            Once again, gaming is a MASSIVE industry, and Marvel has virtually no presence in it. It’s not about “everybody”, which is a dumb argument to even attempt to make. And “not everyone” in the world owns a TV or a cell phone either, but that doesn’t negate the fact that cell phones and TV’s are a huge industry.

            Just own up to the fact that Marvel has, and is perpetually missing the boat when it comes to this medium. Because it’s true, whether you admit to it or not. But admitting it, rather than trying to downplay it, would make you look at least a little more honest.

            I’m only saying that it’s not more important than the film content, as you claim it is. Yes, it’s lucrative. But no more popular or widespread than movies, as I demonstrated.

            I’ve already done that. But so, is this you admitting that AoShit is a fail?

            It is me admitting that Gothurd is a fail.

            Since you can’t remember, then they don’t exist.

            No, I just think any effort to try remembering them is a waste of brain power…If I wanted to I could keep going.

            But WW and Aquaman are now getting movies, so based on your logic, that’s an upgrade, not a fail.

            That’s not my logic…you pulled that out your @55, trying to distract from the fact that those shows got killed in pre-production, just like the shows you want to thumb your nose at Marvel for. You’re tossing $#!+ at them using logic that when applied to DC, would make DC look even worse.

            But in terms of successful DC content, I can name content dating back to the 40’s. You can’t do the same for Marvel, by any stretch. As I said previously, the longest running Marvel TV show was the Hulk, and that was almost 40 years ago. That’s what a successful Marvel TV show looked like.

            Talk to me in 5 years, when Marvel has a TV show (and NOT a 13-hour movie) that’s been on for several seasons, and receives good to great ratings.

            That’s the only crutch you have…finding some twisted and illogical technical reason to dismiss everything Marvel has done well…

            So, this is you feigning stupid again? I said nothing of the sort. Once again, your show, AoShit is FAILING, despite having the backup of a massive movie universe behind it.

            Nothing Marvel is doing is failing. Marvel even managed to make a show about Captain America’s ex last twice as long as Constantine…THAT’s a fail.

            Meanwhile, Constantine had nothing of the sort. Despite having a film that admittedly didn’t do well, Constantine didn’t have much of a presence.

            Ah, yes, the “old one was bad, hence the poor response” excuse…can’t wait for you to use it again when the Green Lantern movie flops…

            And who was the “someone” that was supposed to put them on a better time slot? You do realize that WB does not own NBC, yes?

            You do realize that NBC would’ve put it on a better slot if the show was slightly better than $#!+, right?

            And the only metric for shows being good, are the ratings, genius. If the show can’t get numbers, there will be no reason to keep it.

            Which explains why Constantine got canned and Supergirl got booted off CBS.

            You’ve got some nerve, coming from the king of it. But you can’t disprove any of what I’d said, and until you do, it still stands as valid.

            The single fact that these as well as other Netflix shows have been nominated and actually WON Emmy Television awards, disproves your entire contrived plot…keep trying. You’d be a great laughingstock at the Academy of Television Arts & Sciences.

            I see you didn’t post those “suggestions” from Netflix. And once again, I’ve posted Dc’s numbers. Supergirl’s numbers nearly double those Netflix numbers.

            How nice! I guess with those kind of numbers, it’d be easy to see why CBS won’t touch the second season with a 10ft pole…if only the Marvel Netflix shows had that problem…

            But regardless, if these Netflix shows are so good, then why are their numbers so mediocre? You’ve got a Cinematic Universe (that they don’t truly even belong to, but whatevs), and they’ve got supposedly great story. Yet, their numbers are about the same as DCTV’s “mediocre” numbers.

            To pose your own Q’s back at you, how do you justify these TV shows doing nothing remarkable?

            They really should be lower, considering they’re behind a paywall. The fact they’re in the 4 million viewer range is amazing, hence the reason why instead of dropping the shows like NBC and CBS did to DC, Netflix is asking for MORE shows than they originally bargained for. Instead of having to go and beg networks to promote and play their content, Marvel TV actually has networks coming to them for partnerships…even HBO wants a piece of Marvel content.

            Marvel might not have as many shows, but what they DO have is better quality than DC’s teen dramas and procedurals…

          • SAMURAI36

            Yeah, that’s why they made room on the schedule for a sequel…it did soo bad that the director and producers were brought back for a second helping…because Disney just looooves not making money, right?

            And this negates the fact that Ant-Man underperformed…. How, exactly?

            What’s really dishonest is you trying to throw mud when someone points out that Marvel has developed a successful formula. That’s how this whole argument started, because you can’t take it when someone praises Marvel.

            1) Correction: they have a successful formula for movies. Everything else, they are either barely getting by, or are a complete no-show. And THAT is the point here.

            2) I’d better NEVER hear you complain about DC ever again, if that is the approach you want to take with this.

            3) Actually, YOU can’t take it when someone criticizes Marvel. I get that you are the resident Marvel defense attorney on here, but again, it’s dishonest to act as if none of the criticisms against Marvel are valid.

            Of course it wasn’t…your point was that Marvel is a failure because they lost a subjective battle at an event they didn’t care enough to attend last year. Guess how much “winning SDCC” helped BvS?…Exactly.

            Of course Marvel cares, otherwise they wouldn’t be coming back this year, nor would they attempt to host their own events every other year.

            And winning SDCC won BVS almost $900M, so yeah… “Exactly”.

            LOL! I hope you didn’t fry your brain trying to think of new “sections” where Marvel supposedly fails, like…”Merchandising”…seriously? LMAO!…And comics? Yeah, you want me to “foul up”…by posting the market trend in comics sales of the past couple of years? Yeah, that’d be a huge faux pas…

            http://www.theouthousers.com/i

            Seems to me like Marvel still outsells DC this month…like every month. Big surprise…looking forward to you saying I made your point for you, so you can get out from having to explain how DC wins this one…

            Yep, I knew you were gonna fall right into my trap. As a typical Marvelite, all you see is the dollar signs. What you fail to look at, is the economics of comics. So let me enlighten, not only your ignorant &$$, but anyone else who might be reading this:

            Comics are a dwindling market. Do you know why that is? It’s because Marvel imploded the market 30 years ago, by doing the same tactics back then that they are doing now, gouging and canabalizing the market with over priced books, pointless gimmicks, bullying retail schemes, and the like.

            Even with that link you posted, you obviously looked at the title, and kept it moving, rather than actually reading the info, and examining it closely.

            There are 2 main things to consider, when looking at the comics sales charts. None of which you even bothered to look at.

            First is the fact that DC’s books are far cheaper than Marvel’s, whose books cost 4 bucks on the low end, and as much as 7 bucks on the high end. That’s why Marvel wins the dollar share. However, DC has promised their readers that they will not hike the price, because the comic-reading audience is a very small one, and its demographics can’t afford $7 comic books, which is an OUTRAGEOUS price for a comic book.

            Now, the second thing is, if you look at your very same link, you’ll see that DC only put out 67 titles this month, vs Marvel’s 98. That’s why they are winning the marketshare, because they are flooding the marketplace with books that very few people are actually reading.

            Which leads to another point: the sales charts DO NOT reflect the number of books sold. It only reflects the amount of books that are ordered by local comic shops, and other outlets.

            Which is why comics sales are rather deceptive.

            And this is not counting Marvel’s different monthly reboots, that they disquise as their “All New #1’s”, or their ongoing, line wide “event” books and crossovers, which force readers to buy more books than they usually would, or that they could usually afford in one month, just to get the entire story.

            Basically, all of this is to say, that Marvel’s publication practices are downright dishonest. And I’m not even going to talk about how they tried to bribe various comic book shops to tear up copies of DC books, with the promise of getting shipping discounts on Marvel books.

            Of course you’re not gonna believe me, so here’s the proof right here:

            http://io9.gizmodo.com/5448637/marvel-to-trade-1-comic-for-every-50-destroyed-dc-comics

            And they not only did it once, but TWICE:

            http://io9.gizmodo.com/5824968/marvel-comics-to-reward-comic-shops-for-ripping-up-dc-comics-again

            But folks like to say there’s no competition between Marvel and DC.

            I could go on and on about this subject, about how Perlmutter’s publication practices is what bankrupted Marvel in the first place, but I won’t. Instead, I’d rather you pretend to be ignorant, while I continue to bombard you with info that exposes your precious Marvel.

            I’ll give you animation…but not 3D animation, just regular. And stop motion is still up for grabs…

            LMAO, 3D animation? Stop animation? This is you grasping at straws. This is just another dishonest attempt to not concede that DC is superior in something over Marvel.

            Oh, and before I forget: yeah, “merchandising”, seriously.

            As far as collectibles and games go, Marvel is supremely subpar. They have a serious quality control deficit when it comes to toys, because it’s all licensed, vs DC’s being all in-house.

            Feel free to not believe me if you want. Look it up for yourself.

            But seriously, with live TV, DC isn’t doing anything more special than Marvel; they’re just throwing $#!+ at the wall and hoping it sticks, not to mention ripping Marvel’s pages on crossover titles.

            You’re just making “$#!+” up now. Yes, throwing at the wall, and with the exception of ONE show, they’ve all “stuck” for no less than 2 seasons. You keep trying to sell that nonsense, and that’s what doesn’t stick.

            2 of their shows in the last 5 years have been orphaned,

            Which 2 shows are those? Name them, and stop speaking in codes.

            with at least 2 more that SHOULD be.

            So now you are giving opinions? You can keep those, as they have no relevance whatsoever.

            DC has NOTHING that touches Daredevil or Jessica Jones. If that’s mediocre, then DC has handled their shows in a nauseating fashion.

            So you’re still trying to sell me on those 4M viewer shows, like they are the bee’s knees? If they were so great, then why is their viewership so low? Especially since these shows are connected to the movies via “whiskey bottles” or some such nonsense? You keep dancing around that point, for some reason.

            You were the one to bring up Ant-Man, which is a movie. That’s what you do when you’re keeping things in subject…you talk about that. You only want to talk about the Ant-Man movie so you can paint Marvel as a failure, without talking about the other movies they’ve done…how convenient.

            I named Ant-Man as one example. You do realize that SDCC is more than just about movies, right? And I never once said that “Marvel movies are a failure”. In fact, I’ve continued to say that movies are the one area where Marvel excels. Remember me calling them a one-trick pony?

            But that doesn’t change the fact that Ant-Man was indeed a failure.

            What is there to talk about “TV, in terms of marketing”? Now you wanna twist this into a “marketing” conversation since you know full well Marvel is every bit DC’s equal in the quality aspect? Is “marketing” your “shield” now?

            So now buck-dancing. You acknowledge what we were talking about at the beginning in terms of marketing for Ant-Man, but you’ve somehow forgotten that that was the central topic here?

            Nice to see you don’t change, in terms of your dishonesty.

            This doesn’t even merit a response…you want proof that water is wet too?

            Ahh, so now you don’t need to prove anything you say? Yep, no dishonesty there….

            Not really…All you did was take the focus away from the fact Marvel’s shows for the most part have done well…Agents of SHIELD is on it’s 3rd season, and everyone knows Daredevil and Jessica Jones are hits, and you can’t even deny that.

            There you go, buck-dancing again. I’m beginning to think Bucky is your fave Marvel character, as you do a dance named after him every chance you get.

            It’s not about whether Marvel shows are “doing well”. Especially “doing well” is completely subjective. I like how you move the goal posts on what “doing well” means for Marvel, but not for DC.

            But you don’t get to say “Marvel show are doing well”, but not for DC, under precisely the same circumstances. Cuz that makes you nothing but a hypocrite.

            So what? Marvel shows have achieved the same…only difference is they’re popular enough that they haven’t been dropped twice in the last 5 years.

            What shoes have been “dropped twice”? And why is “5 years” the measurement? How many Marvel vs DC shows have been dropped in the past 30 years?

            See, you only wanna use 5 years as the measure, because that’s your only window of success. DC has 70+ years of success, while Marvel only has 5.

            You’re the one claiming DC has the upper hand in TV; I only have to prove that Marvel is doing well enough to compete, which is what I’ve been saying from the beginning.

            So doing “well enough to compete” is somehow a good thing?

            Why don’t you give me proof that DC has been SUPERIOR, given how Marvel hasn’t had as many cancellations as them, and has been awarded multiple times for their shows as well?

            I’ve already shown you the proof, in the form of the numbers. TWICE. You wanna pretend like I didn’t, because it pains you to acknowledge the fact that DC is better than Marvel in more things than Marvel is better than DC.

            Hurts, don’t it? Doesn’t feel good to get the same dose of reality that you’ve been trying to shove down our throats about DC in terms of movies, does it?

            Once again, DC is better than Marvel at animation, video games, live TV, and merchandising.

            Deal with it.

            Marvel is “mediocre, financially”?

            And you wonder why people think you’re a fanboy…

            Putting words in my mouth? And you wonder why I call you a liar…

            At least I can forgive a studio that only started making their own movies less than 10 years ago…WB/DC has been at it for almost half a century, and all they have to show for it is a bunch of Batman/Superman films at various degrees of quality, along with a couple of mediocre one-offs.

            Ah, so shifting the focus again, are we? Once again, most of the MCU is mediocre at best. The saving grace for it, is that they managed to create a “Cinematic Universe”, which I applaud them for. But beyond that, the quality of their product is questionable.

            And once again, your LYING about DC. If you think all DC has to show for their legacy is a few movies (as usual, that’s all you have as your standard of measurement, is movies, because again, that’s all Marvel has), then you’re completely insane, but realistically just being dishonest.

            Yeah, that’s why Netflix keeps growing and asking for more Marvel shows…

            Yeah, you keep trying to sell me that tune, without a single shred of evidence to support it. Netflix is mediocre at best, and Marvel Netflix is equally so, in terms of subscribers and viewership.

            That’s the problem…WB/DC is trying to do onto TV what Marvel did at the box office…by monopolizing the airwaves with their content to whoever wants to get in on the comic book content craze….Except as seen with Constantine and Supergirl, they’re having a hard time selling it.

            It’s dishonest, how you keep trying to pass Supergirl off as a fail, when that show garnered more ratings than any of your Marvel shows, including your precious Netflix shows.

            And Supergirl just moved from one network to another. And the network they moved to, is owned by the network they moved from. And they only did so, because it was cheaper to do it that way.

            You’re trying to pretend like you don’t know this, which makes you look desperate. The FACT remains, Supergirl is still on the air. None of the lies you are trying to tell can change that.

            You never denied this in your response, so you know I’m right.

            There’s nothing to deny. I’ve already given you all the numbers, and it’s not like they haven’t run these stories on this site before.

            In fact, YOU were the person months ago, that said the Supergirl crossover will never happen.

            Only because they’re still trying to hawk their wares…they just dumped season 1 of Lucifer and Preacher onto Fox and AMC, and they’re going back to NBC for Powerless. Only a matter of time before one or two get dumped back on WB/DC’s feet, again.

            Lucifer is going into it’s second season, with high ratings. Preacher opened to high ratings on AMC. There’s nothing getting “dumped” back on WB feet.

            And with this nonsense about WB “hawking its wares”…. You realize that 30% of all TV content comes from WB, right? And WB content has the highest ratings of all of TV, right?

            So what you’re talking about, is like moving money from my checking account to my savings account.

            Except for Constantine, which was outright cancelled, and Supergirl which had to be saved (ironically).

            The more you say this, the dumber you sound. You’re trying to sell false narratives, and I’m not gonna let you get away with it.

            I love how you think that people talking about how $#!++y BvS was, is somehow a better indicator of quality than people PAYING for each Marvel movie…

            Wanna know why people don’t stay talking about ONE single Marvel movie for months? Because the next one is always around the corner. Even with all this “abundance of DC content”, people are still wiping the smell of BvS off their nose, to this day…I guess that means it was great! LOL!

            Yes, that’s precisely what it means. BVS was great. And LMAO about Marvel movies “right around the corner”. That’s because it’s like Pop music. No substance, so they have to keep beating you in the head with it, in order for it to stick in your mind.

            These Marvel films you love so much, have ZERO substance or value. You can’t even justify half the nonsense that happens in them. Everytime I point out the flaws in these films, the first thing you and other Zombies do, is shift the focus back to DC.

            You’re all scared to discuss these films, because you’re all afraid of the scrutiny that these paper-thin movies will garner.

            I’m only saying that it’s not more important than the film content, as you claim it is. Yes, it’s lucrative. But no more popular or widespread than movies, as I demonstrated.

            Once again, the movies are your only standard of measurement, because that’s all Marvel has to measure with. I know I’ll never get you to see the folly in that, when you are holding all value on 2-hour stories that come out once a year, or every couple of years.

            When you measure this stuff by the actual entertainment value, it seems really foolish to place more emphasis on movies over other forms of entertainment.

            Besides, for you to downplay the video game industry, is just you covering up the fact that Marvel has little to no place in it.

            And also, I never once said it’s more important than movies, but it definitely is as important. Especially when these days A) video games are being made into movies, and B) movies are being made into video games.

            It is me admitting that Gothurd is a fail.

            Deflecting as usual, I see. I mention Marvel, and you mention DC as a deflection. Never mind the fact that “Gothurd” sounds silly as all get-out. It’s not even clever.

            But the fact remains, that Gotham has not once been on the chopping block, whereas AoShit has, every single season since it first aired.

            But of course, you’re gonna find a way to twist that around, and blame that on DC, right?

            No, I just think any effort to try remembering them is a waste of brain power…If I wanted to I could keep going.

            LOL, more excuses from you. I’m challenging you to prove your point, otherwise, you’re just lying, like we both know you usually do.

            That’s the only crutch you have…finding some twisted and illogical technical reason to dismiss everything Marvel has done well…

            Really? Did you say that with a straight face? Because otherwise, you’re a huge hypocrite, Mr. DC is a failure, cuz they don’t have successful movies.

            Which has been the point all this time. You Zombies like to twist the facts to suit you. So once again, I’ll re-iterate:

            DC beats Marvel in TV, animation, video games, and merchandising. Movies are the ONLY thing that Marvel is beating DC in.

            Nothing Marvel is doing is failing. Marvel even managed to make a show about Captain America’s ex last twice as long as Constantine…THAT’s a fail.

            Yes, because a show with 8 episodes per season, teetering on cancellation both seasons, counts as a success.

            Tell me, how many shows are they planning to develop on ABC again? I think I lost count.

            Which explains why Constantine got canned and Supergirl got booted off CBS.

            Yep, and why AoShit is on the chopping block, and why Carter got cancelled, and why ABC won’t touch another Marvel show, right?

            The single fact that these as well as other Netflix shows have been nominated and actually WON Emmy Television awards, disproves your entire contrived plot…keep trying. You’d be a great laughingstock at the Academy of Television Arts & Sciences.

            Actually, the awards that DD in particular won, are not just for TV. And, it wasn’t an “Emmy” that it won anyway. I’ll leave it to you to squirm your way out of what the truth about that actually is. You’re probably gonna throw some link at me, to which I’m gonna have to explain to you how it actually works again, like I did with the comics earlier.

            How nice! I guess with those kind of numbers, it’d be easy to see why CBS won’t touch the second season with a 10ft pole…if only the Marvel Netflix shows had that problem…

            And it’s equally as “nice”, how you LIED about the numbers from Netflix being better than Supergirl’s. Marvel’s TV ratings are getting smashed by DCTV’s ratings. All these terrible DC shows are beating your precious Marvel shows.

            Talk to us, Axxey, about how that feels….

            They really should be lower, considering they’re behind a paywall. The fact they’re in the 4 million viewer range is amazing, hence the reason why instead of dropping the shows like NBC and CBS did to DC, Netflix is asking for MORE shows than they originally bargained for. Instead of having to go and beg networks to promote and play their content, Marvel TV actually has networks coming to them for partnerships…even HBO wants a piece of Marvel content.

            So wait…. Your “logic” is that the numbers should be lower, because they are under a paid subscription?

            So how do you account for the fact that GoT, which is also behind a “paywall”, brought in a whopping 23 MILLION VIEWERS?

            It has the highest ratings of any show on TV, outside of sports shows.

            Your lame excuse makes no sense. Especially considering the fact that the same people are willing to pay $15 bucks for 2 hours of Marvel’s movies, but not 8 bucks a month for 13 hours of Marvel’s TV content.

            That doesn’t compute whatsoever. But leave it to you, to put mustard on a turd, and try to sell it as a gold bar.

            Marvel might not have as many shows, but what they DO have is better quality than DC’s teen dramas and procedurals…

            Back to giving me opinions again, I see. Once again, the numbers don’t reflect that. And you don’t get to use numbers when it suits your position, and ignore them when it doesn’t.

            Marvel’s TV numbers suck, and DC’s doesn’t. Deal with it.

          • Axxell

            And this negates the fact that Ant-Man underperformed…. How, exactly?

            No how…after all, that’s how one of the richest media companies in the world makes their money…by going out of their way to make room in their schedule for “underperforming” movies. Disney moved a bunch of their movies just so they could make a sequel to a disappointing film, right?

            1) Correction: they have a successful formula for movies. Everything else, they are either barely getting by, or are a complete no-show. And THAT is the point here.

            Like I said, Marvel focuses on doing well or the best at what they do and that’s better than trying to cover all the bases, regardless of quality. The result is them dominating at comics, movies, and now putting great product in TV serials.

            3) Actually, YOU can’t take it when someone criticizes Marvel. I get that you are the resident Marvel defense attorney on here, but again, it’s dishonest to act as if none of the criticisms against Marvel are valid.

            I’ve criticized Marvel myself…I haven’t seen you do the same for DC, so who’s the “defense attorney” here?

            Of course Marvel cares, otherwise they wouldn’t be coming back this year, nor would they attempt to host their own events every other year.

            If they really cared, they’d be there EVERY year…and how does hosting their own convention show they care about SDCC? Do you even listen to yourself?

            And winning SDCC won BVS almost $900M, so yeah… “Exactly”.

            LOL!…”Almost”…Do you realize how sad and pathetic that word sounds, for a movie that was supposed to be THE movie event of the century; Supes and Bats together for the first time on screen? And it wasn’t even “almost” $1B…LMAO! And that’s without mentioning the reviews..

            Yep, I knew you were gonna fall right into my trap. As a typical Marvelite, all you see is the dollar signs. What you fail to look at, is the economics of comics.

            Oooh, you got me in a trap! How could I have possibly missed the fact that the comic industry is a charity and not a for-profit business…

            Comics are a dwindling market. Do you know why that is? It’s because Marvel imploded the market 30 years ago, by doing the same tactics back then that they are doing now, gouging and canabalizing the market with over priced books, pointless gimmicks, bullying retail schemes, and the like.

            Good thing we have DC to save the comics industry…Oh wait! They sell even LESS comics than the…”overpriced”, gimmicky Marvel books! Guess people prefer to be “gouged” by Marvel than by DC’s countless reboot gimmicks…

            There are 2 main things to consider, when looking at the comics sales charts. None of which you even bothered to look at.

            First is the fact that DC’s books are far cheaper than Marvel’s, whose books cost 4 bucks on the low end, and as much as 7 bucks on the high end. That’s why Marvel wins the dollar share. However, DC has promised their readers that they will not hike the price, because the comic-reading audience is a very small one, and its demographics can’t afford $7 comic books, which is an OUTRAGEOUS price for a comic book.

            And yet people buy more units of Marvel’s issues than DC. Cheaper should equal more sales…and yet it doesn’t for DC. Did you bother to apply logic to this?

            Now, the second thing is, if you look at your very same link, you’ll see that DC only put out 67 titles this month, vs Marvel’s 98. That’s why they are winning the marketshare, because they are flooding the marketplace with books that very few people are actually reading.

            Keep lying to yourself, as if book stores are drowning in Marvel’s unsold inventory from having to buy 98 titles instead of 67…

            Which leads to another point: the sales charts DO NOT reflect the number of books sold. It only reflects the amount of books that are ordered by local comic shops, and other outlets.

            Welcome to 2005…

            And this is not counting Marvel’s different monthly reboots, that they disquise as their “All New #1’s”, or their ongoing, line wide “event” books and crossovers, which force readers to buy more books than they usually would, or that they could usually afford in one month, just to get the entire story.

            Yea…DC doesn’t do this at all…hello Rebirth…

            Basically, all of this is to say, that Marvel’s publication practices are downright dishonest. And I’m not even going to talk about how they tried to bribe various comic book shops to tear up copies of DC books, with the promise of getting shipping discounts on Marvel books.

            Of course you’re not gonna believe me, so here’s the proof right here:

            Of course I believe you…I totally believe a shop owner is better off ripping up all the excess inventory they had from all those unsold DC books and getting a discount for it, rather than let them collect dust, waiting for nobody to buy them…completely plausible.

            I could go on and on about this subject, about how Perlmutter’s publication practices is what bankrupted Marvel in the first place, but I won’t. Instead, I’d rather you pretend to be ignorant, while I continue to bombard you with info that exposes your precious Marvel.

            I’ll wait for you to get started on that…

            LMAO, 3D animation? Stop animation? This is you grasping at straws. This is just another dishonest attempt to not concede that DC is superior in something over Marvel.

            >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Whoossh….

            o_0

            As far as collectibles and games go, Marvel is supremely subpar. They have a serious quality control deficit when it comes to toys, because it’s all licensed, vs DC’s being all in-house.

            Feel free to not believe me if you want. Look it up for yourself.

            I WILL feel free to not believe you, because even you know this is BS. Really scraping the barrel for something to smear Marvel with…

            Which 2 shows are those? Name them, and stop speaking in codes.

            Oh, stop pretending you don’t know CBS just dropped Supergirl after a single season, following the abortion of Constantine on NBC. Those networks wouldn’t just drop those shows if they were getting a good ROI.

            So now you are giving opinions? You can keep those, as they have no relevance whatsoever.

            They’re way more relevant than your opinions on Agents of SHIELD…which still has better ratings than Arrow, which is now turned into a complete TURD. Please regale me with more excuses as to why it’s ratings are $#!+…

            So you’re still trying to sell me on those 4M viewer shows, like they are the bee’s knees? If they were so great, then why is their viewership so low? Especially since these shows are connected to the movies via “whiskey bottles” or some such nonsense? You keep dancing around that point, for some reason.

            The only one dancing around the point, pathetically hanging on to a disingenuous argument about bottles is you. The shows speak for themselves; while Netflix is asking for MORE Marvel shows, CBS and others are passing on DC’s half baked ideas.

            I named Ant-Man as one example. You do realize that SDCC is more than just about movies, right? And I never once said that “Marvel movies are a failure”. In fact, I’ve continued to say that movies are the one area where Marvel excels. Remember me calling them a one-trick pony?

            But that doesn’t change the fact that Ant-Man was indeed a failure.

            Says…you.

            So now buck-dancing. You acknowledge what we were talking about at the beginning in terms of marketing for Ant-Man, but you’ve somehow forgotten that that was the central topic here?

            Nice to see you don’t change, in terms of your dishonesty.

            Do you really wanna talk about dishonesty, after attempting the bankrupt claim that Ant Man is a failure in any way, despite being better received and getting better ROI than most comparable blockbusters, despite getting awarded Best Comic Book Adaptation? Really…

            The success of marketing is measured in it’s bottom line reception…as BvS shows, flooding every marketing channel is meaningless if the movie doesn’t perform accordingly. And in that sense, marketing for Ant Man was a success.

            Ahh, so now you don’t need to prove anything you say? Yep, no dishonesty there…

            You didn’t prove yur claim either, so…

            It’s not about whether Marvel shows are “doing well”. Especially “doing well” is completely subjective. I like how you move the goal posts on what “doing well” means for Marvel, but not for DC.

            But you don’t get to say “Marvel show are doing well”, but not for DC, under precisely the same circumstances. Cuz that makes you nothing but a hypocrite.

            Well since I never said DC wasn’t doing well, that makes you a crying Nancy. You’re the one claiming Marvel is doing worse than DC, a claim you have yet to back up.

            What shoes have been “dropped twice”? And why is “5 years” the measurement? How many Marvel vs DC shows have been dropped in the past 30 years?

            See, you only wanna use 5 years as the measure, because that’s your only window of success. DC has 70+ years of success, while Marvel only has 5.

            That’s because the focus is in current shows, not what they did on shows that already finished their run.

            So doing “well enough to compete” is somehow a good thing?

            Never said it is, but that’s beside the point, since both are doing about the same on TV content.

            I’ve already shown you the proof, in the form of the numbers. TWICE. You wanna pretend like I didn’t, because it pains you to acknowledge the fact that DC is better than Marvel in more things than Marvel is better than DC.

            Hurts, don’t it? Doesn’t feel good to get the same dose of reality that you’ve been trying to shove down our throats about DC in terms of movies, does it?

            Once again, DC is better than Marvel at animation, video games, live TV, and merchandising.

            LOL! Your incomplete numbers don’t hurt me, especially since I know you’re disingenuously hiding the numbers that don’t fit your narrative…how about talking of Arrow and LoT’s numbers? Oh wait, those sucked…even worse than AoS, which yu hate so much. That must be painful to have to hide facts or come up with excuses for them because you know they’re too inconvenient…

            Deal with that…

            Putting words in my mouth? And you wonder why I call you a liar…

            No, I KNOW you call me a liar when you run out of arguments. I don’t have to wonder…The quote is there for all to see, so you can call me a liar all you want…

            Ah, so shifting the focus again, are we? Once again, most of the MCU is mediocre at best. The saving grace for it, is that they managed to create a “Cinematic Universe”, which I applaud them for. But beyond that, the quality of their product is questionable.

            What does that make the DCCU, with worse reviews and worse reception than the MCU?

            And once again, your LYING about DC. If you think all DC has to show for their legacy is a few movies (as usual, that’s all you have as your standard of measurement, is movies, because again, that’s all Marvel has), then you’re completely insane, but realistically just being dishonest.

            Just because it hurts you to talk about Marvel’s success doesn’t mean I can’t point it out. As I’ve already demonstrated, Marvel has already become competitive in the TV department (thanks to that success), so I COULD talk about TV if I wanted to as well. But this is about how WB/DC let Marvel catch up to them in the films aspect, despite having decades of in-house financing to fund their projects.

            Yeah, you keep trying to sell me that tune, without a single shred of evidence to support it. Netflix is mediocre at best, and Marvel Netflix is equally so, in terms of subscribers and viewership.

            Must be hard living in constant denial they way you are…Netflix already has more subscribers in the US than any home video service, accounting for more than 30% of internet traffic. And they have the highest growth rate of any competitor in the world.

            You WISH you had a business that “mediocre”.

            It’s dishonest, how you keep trying to pass Supergirl off as a fail, when that show garnered more ratings than any of your Marvel shows, including your precious Netflix shows.

            And Supergirl just moved from one network to another. And the network they moved to, is owned by the network they moved from. And they only did so, because it was cheaper to do it that way.

            You’re trying to pretend like you don’t know this, which makes you look desperate. The FACT remains, Supergirl is still on the air. None of the lies you are trying to tell can change that.

            You can excuse it however you want, but even CBS president admitted the ratings slipped to the point where it wasn’t worth it…all the flashy special effects that kept people ooing and aaahing could only mask poor programming for so long.

            “The ratings did start a little higher and they came down a bit,” CBS president Glenn Geller said Wednesday morning at a press conference at the network’s New York City headquarters.

            http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/supergirl-cbs-president-reaction-cw-1201777795/

            Which non-WB DC content is that, exactly? Please list some examples. I dare you. Or are you gonna conveniently forget which ones those are again, like you did before?

            Did you forget about the first Superman movie, Superman and the Mole Men? Or maybe you know less about DC history than me. There’s also the even worse Supergirl movie (even worse than BvS, if one can believe that). And don’t forget the equally nauseating Swamp Thing movies…

            So what? What you continue to miss, is the fact that the DC lego games are rated far better than the Marvel ones.

            So why should Marvel be “thankful” to WB for making a mediocre game?

            Wait….. Did you just try to say that Lego isn’t a huge franchise? We must be talking about 2 different Legos. Clearly you don’t mean the $12B Lego franchise.

            You do realize that Lego is worth more than Marvel is, right?

            You DO realize Marvel Studios has made $10B in MCU revenue alone, right?

            So then, why did they go to Lego/WB to make this game for them? And clearly their video game content doesn’t sell, since A) they have have no game content, and B) they need to go to their competitors for their expertise.

            Were you dropped as a child? I just told you Marvel does not go to Lego or WB to make this game…THEY’re the ones who ask Marvel to license their property since it is Marvel’s IP.

            There’s nothing to deny. I’ve already given you all the numbers, and it’s not like they haven’t run these stories on this site before.

            In fact, YOU were the person months ago, that said the Supergirl crossover will never happen.

            Glad we could agree that Supergirl was dumped, just like Constantine.

            Lucifer is going into it’s second season, with high ratings. Preacher opened to high ratings on AMC. There’s nothing getting “dumped” back on WB feet.

            And with this nonsense about WB “hawking its wares”…. You realize that 30% of all TV content comes from WB, right? And WB content has the highest ratings of all of TV, right?

            Right…remind me what Arrow and Legends of Tomorrow’s ratings are like? Seems like WB only cares about dumping as many shows onto TV as possible, instead of trying to make their current shows better.

            The more you say this, the dumber you sound. You’re trying to sell false narratives, and I’m not gonna let you get away with it.

            You can’t do anything because the simple fact is, you know I’m right.

            Yes, that’s precisely what it means. BVS was great.

            LMFAO!! You’re so sadly in denial…I pity you.

            And LMAO about Marvel movies “right around the corner”. That’s because it’s like Pop music. No substance, so they have to keep beating you in the head with it, in order for it to stick in your mind.

            These Marvel films you love so much, have ZERO substance or value. You can’t even justify half the nonsense that happens in them. Everytime I point out the flaws in these films, the first thing you and other Zombies do, is shift the focus back to DC.

            You’re all scared to discuss these films, because you’re all afraid of the scrutiny that these paper-thin movies will garner.

            I don’t need to…I’ve already owned you several times about this same subject. The reviews back me up; the box office results back me up. All you have is your childish fanboy tantrums to argue some conspiracy about how everyone has it against DC.

            Once again, the movies are your only standard of measurement, because that’s all Marvel has to measure with. I know I’ll never get you to see the folly in that, when you are holding all value on 2-hour stories that come out once a year, or every couple of years.

            When you measure this stuff by the actual entertainment value, it seems really foolish to place more emphasis on movies over other forms of entertainment.

            Of course…why wouldn’t you try to downplay the importance of film? You’ve run out of ways to spin a story about DC somehow being superior, when the biggest film in DC’s history is a bust, while only weeks later Marvel manages to make the year’s biggest blockbuster with a ragtag of “lesser” characters…

            Besides, for you to downplay the video game industry, is just you covering up the fact that Marvel has little to no place in it.

            I already said as much; Marvel’s first order of business after dominating the film industry was to focus on TV, not videogames. Now that they’re competitive in TV, they’re ready to start working on quality interactive entertainment.

            Deflecting as usual, I see. I mention Marvel, and you mention DC as a deflection. Never mind the fact that “Gothurd” sounds silly as all get-out. It’s not even clever.

            But the fact remains, that Gotham has not once been on the chopping block, whereas AoShit has, every single season since it first aired.

            But of course, you’re gonna find a way to twist that around, and blame that on DC, right?

            Sure…if you wanna believe that, go ahead. Let’s forget that you keep dodging the fact that there’s at least 2 DC shows with a worse viewer rating than the lowest rated Marvel show…I’m sure you have an excuse for that…

            LOL, more excuses from you. I’m challenging you to prove your point, otherwise, you’re just lying, like we both know you usually do.

            LOL! The only one presenting facts here is me; you said about Marvel, and I quote: All their other TV projects have either been cancelled, or shut down in pre-production., which you never bothered to prove…and yet you have the nerve to call me a liar when we all know you can’t open your mouth without lying…I on the other hand, can easily prove my statement about DC having plenty of cancellations:

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_television_series_based_on_DC_Comics#Pilots

            Where’s YOUR proof about all of Marvel’s projects being cancelled? Oh, that’s right…it doesn’t exist. But I’m sure you’ll try to weasel your way out of this argument, again.

            Really? Did you say that with a straight face? Because otherwise, you’re a huge hypocrite, Mr. DC is a failure, cuz they don’t have successful movies.

            Which has been the point all this time. You Zombies like to twist the facts to suit you. So once again, I’ll re-iterate:

            DC beats Marvel in TV, animation, video games, and merchandising. Movies are the ONLY thing that Marvel is beating DC in.

            And that is a lie. You’re grasping at straws to try and dismiss all that Marvel has accomplished on TV in the span of a half decade, and ignorantly dismissing the comic book medium to prop up your argument.

            At the same time, you want to sweep all of DC’s failures under the rug with your poor excuses for the cancellation of Constantine, as well as Legends of Tomorrow having the worst viewer ratings for a comic book based show on TV. And with all this you wanna claim that DC beats Marvel?

            Yes, because a show with 8 episodes per season, teetering on cancellation both seasons, counts as a success.

            Compared to a show that’s already cancelled one season in, yes, that IS a success.

            Yep, and why AoShit is on the chopping block, and why Carter got cancelled, and why ABC won’t touch another Marvel show, right?

            ABC has more Marvel shows than CBS and NBC have DC shows.

            Actually, the awards that DD in particular won, are not just for TV. And, it wasn’t an “Emmy” that it won anyway. I’ll leave it to you to squirm your way out of what the truth about that actually is. You’re probably gonna throw some link at me, to which I’m gonna have to explain to you how it actually works again, like I did with the comics earlier.

            No, that’s actually called “spin”…You never could deny the fact that despite your accusations and claims, DC still plays second fiddle to Marvel in comics.

            As far as this comment, you conveniently ignored the point I was making, that Netflix shows belong in the TV category, no matter how desperately you’d like to separate them as “13 hour movies” in order to help your argument. If they’re in the running for Emmy awards, even if Daredevil didn’t win, it means it’s every bit a TV show as anything DC has put out.

            And it’s equally as “nice”, how you LIED about the numbers from Netflix being better than Supergirl’s. Marvel’s TV ratings are getting smashed by DCTV’s ratings. All these terrible DC shows are beating your precious Marvel shows.

            That’s why those DC shows keep getting dropped, right? How does it feel that Constantine sucked so bad that it couldn’t even outlast a show about Captain America’s ex? How does it feel not having anyone to talk to about the latest episodes of Arrow or Legends of Tomorrow because nobody watches either of those turds?

            So wait…. Your “logic” is that the numbers should be lower, because they are under a paid subscription?

            So how do you account for the fact that GoT, which is also behind a “paywall”, brought in a whopping 23 MILLION VIEWERS?

            It has the highest ratings of any show on TV, outside of sports shows.

            None of that negates the fact that a paywall will hurt viewership…a less accessible platform will always produce lesser ratings, even if they’re astronomically high.

            Your lame excuse makes no sense. Especially considering the fact that the same people are willing to pay $15 bucks for 2 hours of Marvel’s movies, but not 8 bucks a month for 13 hours of Marvel’s TV content.

            I already proved why that’s a false comparison. No need to address again.

            Back to giving me opinions again, I see. Once again, the numbers don’t reflect that. And you don’t get to use numbers when it suits your position, and ignore them when it doesn’t.

            Marvel’s TV numbers suck, and DC’s doesn’t. Deal with it.

            Only when you get to addressing ALL of DC’s shows and not just the ones convenient to your argument, do you get to lecture me about “using numbers when it suits you”…Like I said, only DC has had 2 shows dropped by their networks. And Legends of Tomorrow has the worst ratings for a comic book show; that’s a fact you’re gonna have to “deal with”…

          • SAMURAI36

            No how…after all, that’s how one of the richest media companies in the world makes their money…by going out of their way to make room in their schedule for “underperforming” movies. Disney moved a bunch of their movies just so they could make a sequel to a disappointing film, right?

            That’s exactly right. For you to act like Marvel isn’t taking a chance on making a sequel based on the original that underperformed, and isn’t pandering by adding a female character to the roster, is completely disingenuous.

            Not saying that it can’t be successful, because Marvel has shown that they can make unknown properties work, but this hasn’t been one of them. So it sounds like they are trying to add more to it, in order to make it work.

            Which is fine, but that doesn’t equate to an automatic success. And if they treat this new film the same way as the first one, with a light marketing campaign, then they’ll have no one to blame but themselves for its failure.

            Like I said, Marvel focuses on doing well or the best at what they do and that’s better than trying to cover all the bases, regardless of quality. The result is them dominating at comics, movies, and now putting great product in TV serials.

            You keep trying to sell that as a positive spin on the narrative, in hopes that it’ll sound better. The reality is, Marvel has tried their hand at other mediums. And FAILED. And they are still trying. And FAILING.

            It’d be different if they said “you know what, we’ve made a go of animation and video games, and it didn’t really work out for us, so we’re just gonna stick with what we know/are good at”.

            But that’s not what they are doing, and you know it’s not.

            I’ve criticized Marvel myself…I haven’t seen you do the same for DC, so who’s the “defense attorney” here?

            Really? When have you criticized them? I’ve been reading and rebutting your statements for the better part of a year now, and I’ve yet to read anything that comes off as even remotely critical of Marvel. Do you do it at home, in bed, with your head under the covers, so that only you can hear it?

            Either way, prove it. Do it right now. Give me 5 grievances you have with Marvel. I’m willing to bet you can’t. And the reason why I know you can’t, is because I’ve made dozens of critiques about Marvel in this convo alone, and you’ve attempted to rebut each and every single one. And we’ve covered numerous topics here.

            And I’ve criticized DC more than once on here. And I can do so again, if need be.

            If they really cared, they’d be there EVERY year…and how does hosting their own convention show they care about SDCC? Do you even listen to yourself?

            Quit being so disingenuous. I’m talking caring about creating a buzz. And they do care. No one is making them show up at Cons every/other year. It costs money for them to buy into these Cons, even when it’s their own Con.

            LOL!…”Almost”…Do you realize how sad and pathetic that word sounds, for a movie that was supposed to be THE movie event of the century; Supes and Bats together for the first time on screen? And it wasn’t even “almost” $1B…LMAO! And that’s without mentioning the reviews..

            Yep, almost, even with the terrible reviews. How does that happen, exactly?

            In fact, I need for you to explain to me, how the alleged worst comic book movie of all time, managed to not only come just shy of making $1B, but also managed to gross more than 90% of all Marvel films (Disney and non-Disney), despite all the good/great reviews of those films?

            Oh, and while we’re on the subject of the reviews, for all the flack haters like you try to make about that subject, the reality is, BVS’s reviews are not that bad. It’s only the RT reviews that are the issue, but whenever you got to any other sites like Amazon, IMDB, and numerous others, the reviews range from good to excellent.

            Now, I dare you to try to disprove this fact.

            Oooh, you got me in a trap! How could I have possibly missed the fact that the comic industry is a charity and not a for-profit business…

            Yeah, that sounds real dumb, like you don’t really have a point to refute what I said.

            Nobody’s talking about charity. But to cannibalize off of a dwindling audience, with shoddy, gouging business practices is dishonest, to the level of Trump proportions.

            No wonder you like Marvel so much, as they are staunch Trump supporters as well.

            Good thing we have DC to save the comics industry…Oh wait! They sell even LESS comics than the…”overpriced”, gimmicky Marvel books! Guess people prefer to be “gouged” by Marvel than by DC’s countless reb oot gimmicks…

            So, this is you doubling down on your stupidity? It’s like you’re trying to be deliberately obtuse. But that’s okay, because even though I’m enjoying this roasting I’m giving you, with continuing to make you even more silly than you already make yourself look, there are people who read this stuff, who may not be informed about this stuff, so it’s my duty to give them the 411, while I’m giving you the business.

            That said…

            No one is preferring to be gouged, except perhaps the retailers. Once again, GENIUS, the numbers only reflect the store orders, not the actual sales from customers. Those numbers have NEVER been released, mostly because they are far too difficult to capture and compile.

            Nonetheless, it’s funny that you keep talking about “DC’s Reboot Gimmicks”…. You do realize that DC has only rebooted their entire universe a whopping total of 3 TIMES, in 80 years. Soooo, what “countless reboot gimmicks” are you talking about, exactly?

            Looking forward to you make a fool out of yourself with the (non) answer to this one….

            And yet people buy more units of Marvel’s issues than DC. Cheaper should equal more sales…and yet it doesn’t for DC. Did you bother to apply logic to this?

            See above. More people aren’t buying Marvel. It’s just that Marvel traps retailers into ordering more copies, thru their various gimmicks (100:1 so-called “incentives”, variant covers, etc).

            So, instead of rebooting like Marvel actually does (8 times in the past 3 years, not including their recent reboot: http://comicbook.com/marvel/2016/06/30/marvel-announces-divided-we-stand/ ), you’re saying it’s a bad thing that DC should not just stick to making great content, without the bells and whistles?

            Keep lying to yourself, as if book stores are drowning in Marvel’s unsold inventory from having to buy 98 titles instead of 67…

            You just don’t know when to quit, do you? Instead of just conceding a point that you know full well you don’t have a leg to stand on, you just keep posting dumb comments, in attempts to save face, regardless of the facts that I keep knocking you in the head with.

            It’s really sad when you don’t know when to keep your mouth shut. You’re not even really refuting anything right now, just talking out your &$$.

            But very well, I’ll just keep kicking you in your head with the facts:

            http://www.bleedingcool.com/2016/06/30/dc-rebirth-continues-to-smash-marvel-on-advance-reorders/

            Meanwhile:

            http://www.bleedingcool.com/2016/06/30/marvel-announces-divided-we-stand/

            Besides the numbers I just gave, look at the comments in both links, especially the second one. Over 100 comments, and none of it is positive about Marvel. And Bleeding Fool is usually a pro-Marvel site. But everyone is complaining about the quality of Marvel’s books as of late. No one is caring about their fake diversity campaign

            And it’s not just that one site, but several others as well. And I know you don’t believe me, so here’s the proof:

            http://comicbook.com/marvel/2016/06/30/marvel-announces-divided-we-stand/

            http://community.comicbookresources.com/showthread.php?80420-Marvel-NOW!-Teasers-Pay-Off-With-Enigmatic-Divided-We-Stand-Group-Shot

            http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/06/30/marvel-follows-up-civil-war-ii-with-divided-we-stand

            And that’s just a few of the more popular sites. Page after page, post after post of people expressing their dissatisfaction with Marvel, while there’s a renewed sense of interest in DC.

            Little by little, all that good will that Marvel had garnered for their books is slowly going away. History is repeating itself from 30 years ago, when Marvel crashed the market back then. People are getting tired of Marvel’s same ol’-same ol’, and I suspect the same thing will happen with their movies too.

            Welcome to 2005…

            What does that even mean?? You know what, never mind.

            Yea…DC doesn’t do this at all…hello Rebirth…

            Yes, cuz 3 reboots in 80 years is a MASSIVE gimmick. At least have the common decency to know what you’re talking about, before posting this nonsense.

            Of course I believe you…I totally believe a shop owner is better off ripping up all the excess inventory they had from all those unsold DC books and getting a discount for it, rather than let them collect dust, waiting for nobody to buy them…completely plausible.

            Wow, really dude? You just can’t admit when you’re wrong, huh?

            Here’s the problem with what you just said:

            1) Marvel’s not interested in doing retail shops any “favors”. They only did it to hurt DC. So much for “there’s no competition between these companies”, huh?

            2) The books they were trying to get the stores to rip up, were not “excess inventory”. It was Blackest Night, literally THE highest selling comic book of the past decade.

            3) Marvel was asking retailers to rip up 50 DC books, for 1 Marvel book as an incentive. Not only is this massively out of balance, but the 1 Marvel book they were trying to pedal, wasn’t even that great of a book to begin with. So, you’re going to trade 50 of your top selling books, for one mediocre book????

            Surely you’re not that dumb. Only a dishonest person would try to rationalize that as being anything other than a dishonest practice.

            I’ll wait for you to get started on that…

            Yeah, I bet you will. Mr. “I’ve criticized Marvel before”….. When you have Ike Perlmutter, the champion racist, woman-hater, and Trump supporter as the head of your company, the anti-Marvel arguments basically make themselves.

            Oh, and here’s a random fault on the part of Marvel: What about when they overcharge people for their movie tickets?

            http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Movie-Theaters-Pleased-With-Disney-Over-Avengers-Related-Demands-71267.html

            http://www.slashfilm.com/avengers-2-theater-dispute/

            So while this is technically not Marvel per se, I’m left to wonder 2 things: If WB had jacked the price up for BVS:

            1) Would it have made well over $1B, since it was only $100M shy of the $B mark?

            2) Since the Disney story didn’t pick up any traction, I wonder how people would have reacted, if WB/DC engaged in the same dirty business practices?

            >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Whoossh….

            o_0

            It’s sad, watching someone continue to lose, when all they have to do is just throw in the towel. Marvel really should pick better representatives for their PR. You’re terrible at it.

            I WILL feel free to not believe you, because even you know this is BS. Really scraping the barrel for something to smear Marvel with…

            So, instead of proving me wrong, which you already know you can’t do, you’ll just stick your head in the sand, and act like you’re in denial?

            *sigh*

            https://www.facebook.com/groups/1633208626935113/

            This time you only get one link. I’m tired of giving you several links, just to act like you don’t know WTF I’m talking about.

            But the point is, Marvel doesn’t have an in-house manufacturer, so every piece of merch they have is licensed to other companies. At this point, comics is the only in-house product that Marvel makes.

            Meanwhile, guess who owns DC Collectibles?

            They’re way more relevant than your opinions on Agents of SHIELD…which still has better ratings than Arrow, which is now turned into a complete TURD. Please regale me with more excuses as to why it’s ratings are $#!+…

            So, at this point, you’re not even trying to refute anything, just deflecting. But I’ll play your game a little while longer…

            Arrow is on a small network, and a paid cable network at that. Meanwhile, AoShit is A) on a major network, and B) has the backing of a huge “Cinematic Universe”, and yet it still can barely do better than DC’s so-called “$#!+” show.

            AoShit should be taking in 5 times the amount of viewers. But instead, it’s on the brink of getting cancelled, while Arrow isn’t.

            Let me know what your excuse for that is.

            The shows speak for themselves; while Netflix is asking for MORE Marvel shows, CBS and others are passing on DC’s half baked ideas.

            1) Netflix itself is a mediocre service, so of course they are going to ask for anything that will help boost sales and views for them. That’s not anything to brag about.

            2) You keep saying CBS “and others” are passing on DC. Even if I acquiesce to your CBS point (which I don’t), who are these “others” you are trying to slide in? Because you have yet to produce ANY facts here. Not a single reference, no links, nothing. You’re just talking out your &$$.

            So prove your point, please.

            Well since I never said DC wasn’t doing well, that makes you a crying Nancy. You’re the one claiming Marvel is doing worse than DC, a claim you have yet to back up.

            Wow, you’re a huge liar man. I really need to rethink how much time I spend talking to you, after this response.

            But just the same, I am claiming that Marvel TV is doing worse than DCTV.

            In much the same light as how you try to say BVS should have done much better, given the marketing campaign they unleashed, the very same applies to Marvel on Netflix. The movie fans are not showing up for this stuff. Where are they? Why is that?

            The reality is, you don’t have an answer. And that’s why you can’t even begin to entertain the question. There’s a 90% drop-off from film to TV for Marvel, and you’re stumped as to why, despite the false “It’s all connected” gimmick.

            All the whiskey bottles and newspaper clippings in the world aren’t gonna bring these people in to Marvel TV.

            LOL! Your incomplete numbers don’t hurt me, especially since I know you’re disingenuously hiding the numbers that don’t fit your narrative…how about talking of Arrow and LoT’s numbers? Oh wait, those sucked…even worse than AoS, which yu hate so much. That must be painful to have to hide facts or come up with excuses for them because you know they’re too inconvenient…

            You keep saying this, like it’s supposed to mean something. Arrow’s numbers are irrelevant. None of DCTV shows are getting cancelled, nor are they in any danger of such.

            But I know you read the link I posted, where it’s been admitted that AoShit is on the chopping block.

            Just because it hurts you to talk about Marvel’s success doesn’t mean I can’t point it out. As I’ve already demonstrated, Marvel has already become competitive in the TV department (thanks to that success), so I COULD talk about TV if I wanted to as well. But this is about how WB/DC let Marvel catch up to them in the films aspect, despite having decades of in-house financing to fund their projects.

            Ah yes, the typical “Marvel’s movies are great, and that’s all that matters” argument.

            Must be hard living in constant denial they way you are…Netflix already has more subscribers in the US than any home video service, accounting for more than 30% of internet traffic. And they have the highest growth rate of any competitor in the world.

            Prove it. And not with those janky-&$$ numbers you posted before, because I shredd that nonsense already.

            You can excuse it however you want, but even CBS president admitted the ratings slipped to the point where it wasn’t worth it…all the flashy special effects that kept people ooing and aaahing could only mask poor programming for so long.

            “The ratings did start a little higher and they came down a bit,” CBS president Glenn Geller said Wednesday morning at a press conference at the network’s New York City headquarters.

            http://variety.com/2016/tv/new

            Wow, really? So you just chopped up the quote, and only posted the part that fed your narrative, as if I’m too dumb to look up the rest of the quote?

            Here’s what was actually said:

            “I think it found the right home. It’s a win-win for us. We co-own the CW and we made a great deal with Warner Bros.”

            Gellar added, “Who’s to say if we hadn’t made that deal that we wouldn’t have picked it up.”

            So there was nothing to lose, especially since CBS owns CW. Once, NOTHING was in danger of getting cancelled.

            So why should Marvel be “thankful” to WB for making a mediocre game?

            Because were it not for WB, Marvel wouldn’t have a decent game right now.

            You DO realize Marvel Studios has made $10B in MCU revenue alone, right?

            http://www.newsarama.com/24999-disney-s-4-billion-marvel-buy-was-it-worth-it.html

            “Considering both the Avengers economics and that Disney’s five-year Enterprise Value [a measure of a company’s total value] has grown nearly 20%, it appears the $4 billion purchase was justified,” says John Holbeck. “I think Marvel is worth the [2006] Pixar price of $9 billion,” He says.

            You were saying?

            Right…remind me what Arrow and Legends of Tomorrow’s ratings are like? Seems like WB only cares about dumping as many shows onto TV as possible, instead of trying to make their current shows better.

            Just like Marvel cares about dumping as many movies, comics, and toys as possible, and not being concerned with them being better, right?

            I don’t need to…I’ve already owned you several times about this same subject. The reviews back me up; the box office results back me up. All you have is your childish fanboy tantrums to argue some conspiracy about how everyone has it against DC.

            Riiiiight. When did that happen, again? Post some links of when you “owned” me. Because all you’ve done, since I first began talking to you, is deflecting with your one-liners.

            I dare you to pick a Marvel film, and discuss it with me. But we both know you’re gonna run and buck dance.

            I already said as much; Marvel’s first order of business after dominating the film industry was to focus on TV, not videogames. Now that they’re competitive in TV, they’re ready to start working on quality interactive entertainment.

            LMAO, you just made that BS up. Prove right now, that this is their game plan.

            Sure…if you wanna believe that, go ahead. Let’s forget that you keep dodging the fact that there’s at least 2 DC shows with a worse viewer rating than the lowest rated Marvel show…I’m sure you have an excuse for that…

            Yep, just like AoShit is on the chopping block of cancellation. How’s that working out?

            LOL! The only one presenting facts here is me; you said about Marvel, and I quote: All their other TV projects have either been cancelled, or shut down in pre-production., which you never bothered to prove…and yet you have the nerve to call me a liar when we all know you can’t open your mouth without lying…I on the other hand, can easily prove my statement about DC having plenty of cancellations:

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/

            Where’s YOUR proof about all of Marvel’s projects being cancelled? Oh, that’s right…it doesn’t exist. But I’m sure you’ll try to weasel your way out of this argument, again.

            That’s not what I said, you illiterate idiot. My statement was as follows;

            All their other TV projects have either been cancelled, or shut down in pre-production.

            Carter has been cancelled, and MMW has been halted production. And once again, AoShit is on the chopping block.

            What’s so hard to understand about what I said. RIF.

            And that is a lie. You’re grasping at straws to try and dismiss all that Marvel has accomplished on TV in the span of a half decade, and ignorantly dismissing the comic bo ok medium to prop up your argument.

            Accomplishing something in half a decade is not a qualifier for being ahead of the game. Which Marvel is not, when it comes to TV.

            When you have more shows than DC, then you can talk. And when you have shows with higher ratings than DC’s highest rated shows do, then you can talk.

            Until then, DC is beating Marvel on the TV front.

            As far as comics go, I’ve already shown you that Marvel is slowly losing ground on the comics aspect, which was tedious as it is, even with their felonious business practices.

            ABC has more Marvel shows than CBS and NBC have DC shows.

            Actually, as of this coming fall, NBC will have the same number of DC shows, as ABC has Marvel shows. And NBC’s DC show won’t be on the verge of cancellation, the way ABC’s Marvel show is.

            http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/nbc-vows-not-cancel-shows-906370

            No, that’s actually called “spin”…You never could deny the fact that despite your accusations and claims, DC still plays second fiddle to Marvel in comics.

            For someone that likes to play the “throwing stuff at the wall” argument for DC’s shows, you sure have no probs with Marvel throwing their print product to that very same wall.

            Also, just so you’re aware, Marvel’s paper quality has long since been subpar, in comparison to DC’s. It’s thin, it bleeds, and it tears easily, especially during shipping. Also, DC pays their creators a higher page rate than Marvel does.

            Of course you’ll think I’m lying about all this, so feel free to look it up. But before you accuse me of lying, present your info here, or STFU.

            None of that negates the fact that a paywall will hurt viewership…a less accessible platform will always produce lesser ratings, even if they’re astronomically high.

            Wow, really? This is the argument you wanna use in favor of Netflix, but someohow that doesn’t apply to DCTV on the CW? IF this site would allow me to call you more names other than a liar and a hypocrite, I would.

            But beyond that fact, once again I ask: how do you account for GoT wiping out EVERYTHING (with the exception of sports and the news)? HBO has the highest pay sub cost, and yet it’s shows are ranking higher than almost everything on TV>

            Which is why that “paywall” nonsense doesn’t mean a hill of beans, nor does it negate the fact that Marvel Netflix should at least be doubling its viewership. NOTHING with Marvel’s name on it is doing more than 5M viewers on TV. And that’s whether it’s on a major network with a primetime schedule, or on the so-called fastest growing streaming service.

            I already proved why that’s a false comparison. No need to address again.

            You didn’t prove anything, and you don’t want to address it, because you know you can’t. HBO costs nearly twice as much a month as Netflix, and yet the lowest rated HBO original show outranks the highest Netflix show. And this is with the fact that HBO NEVER advertises their content, whereas Netflix advertises everywhere.

            There’s no justification whatsoever for Marvel Netflix’s weak numbers. Again, with a massive cinematic universe backing it, Marvel should be blowing EVERYTHING out of the water.

            But the reality is, you don’t have an answer, and I’m wagering that it probably keeps you up at night, most likely the same as it does Marvel. None of your Marvel overlords can figure out why their film success is not translating over to other mediums, where they suffer from mediocrity at best, and nothing whatsoever at worst.

            So like I said, deal with it.

          • Axxell

            That’s exactly right. For you to act like Marvel isn’t taking a chance on making a sequel based on the original that underperformed, and isn’t pandering by adding a female character to the roster, is completely disingenuous.

            Not saying that it can’t be successful, because Marvel has shown that they can make unknown properties work, but this hasn’t been one of them.

            The fact you’re alone in this says it all. Ant-Man was a success even before it was awarded “Best comic book adaptation of the year”…So you’re obviously full of $#!+.

            You keep trying to sell that as a positive spin on the narrative, in hopes that it’ll sound better. The reality is, Marvel has tried their hand at other mediums. And FAILED. And they are still trying. And FAILING.

            Keep repeating it…maybe in a million years you’ll forget DC has had more failures than Marvel, despite decades of headstart…

            Really? When have you criticized them? I’ve been reading and rebutting your statements for the better part of a year now, and I’ve yet to read anything that comes off as even remotely critical of Marvel.

            That’s because you can’t read what’s in front of your eyes…

            https://heroichollywood.com/white-iron-fist-sparks-racial-controversy-and-criticism/

            Quit being so disingenuous. I’m talking caring about creating a buzz. And they do care. No one is making them show up at Cons every/other year. It costs money for them to buy into these Cons, even when it’s their own Con.

            No…the subject was SDCC. You’ve been so starved for a victory, you scream about WB/DC “beating” Marvel Studios because they created more buzz in a comic-con where they went against…nobody else, given Marvel didn’t care enough to attend.

            Yep, almost, even with the terrible reviews. How does that happen, exactly?

            In fact, I need for you to explain to me, how the alleged worst comic book movie of all time, managed to not only come just shy of making $1B, but also managed to gross more than 90% of all Marvel films (Disney and non-Disney), despite all the good/great reviews of those films?

            Brand and hype…like I’ve been saying all along. The fact the movie had THE biggest opening followed by the biggest dropoff, says that the movie didn’t match the buzz going in. Not even close. And everyone sees it.

            Oh, and while we’re on the subject of the reviews, for all the flack haters like you try to make about that subject, the reality is, BVS’s reviews are not that bad. It’s only the RT reviews that are the issue, but whenever you got to any other sites like Amazon, IMDB, and numerous others, the reviews range from good to excellent.

            Basically, anywhere that a DC fanboy can go in the middle of night and make an argument as compelling as…clicking on 5 out of 5 stars…too bad fanboys can’t influence professional reviews that easily…

            Loving the creativity in your excuses though…as if RT made up the average critics score:

            http://i.imgur.com/sL6s5Db.png

            Yeah, that sounds real dumb, like you don’t really have a point to refute what I said.

            Nobody’s talking about charity. But to cannibalize off of a dwindling audience, with shoddy, gouging business practices is dishonest, to the level of Trump proportions.

            Well since you say Marvel suck at anything other than movies, why are you bi+ching about “business practices” and them “cannibalizing” the comics biz? Oh, I almost forgot your comments suffer from logic deficiency…

            And it’s funny how you preach from your high horse about “gouging business practices” when DC is making you pay $6/month to keep up with their stories

            So, this is you doubling down on your stupidity? It’s like you’re trying to be deliberately obtuse. But that’s okay, because even though I’m enjoying this roasting I’m giving you, with continuing to make you even more silly than you already make yourself look, there are people who read this stuff, who may not be informed about this stuff, so it’s my duty to give them the 411, while I’m giving you the business.

            Ladies and Gents, this is him pretending to sound smart by dancing around the undisputable simple fact Marvel is beating DC in comics…Notice that despite the verbosity, he coudn’t actually say I’m wrong…so he had to stuff his comment with empty rhetoric…

            No one is preferring to be gouged, except perhaps the retailers. Once again, GENIUS, the numbers only reflect the store orders, not the actual sales from customers. Those numbers have NEVER been released, mostly because they are far too difficult to capture and compile.

            Of course…that’s the most predictable excuse you could make…pretend DC outsells Marvel comics, even when retailers are ordering MORE Marvel titles. Because it’s better to act like retailers have so little business acumen so as to order MORE of the less popular titles…

            Continue deluding yourself…

            Nonetheless, it’s funny that you keep talking about “DC’s Reboot Gimmicks”…. You do realize that DC has only rebooted their entire universe a whopping total of 3 TIMES, in 80 years. Soooo, what “countless reboot gimmicks” are you talking about, exactly?

            The same ones everyone is talking about…but feel free to stand in your own echo chamber…the rest of us know DC’s reputation:

            http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/unpacking-dc-comics-reboots-relaunches-retcons

            See above. More people aren’t buying Marvel. It’s just that Marvel traps retailers into ordering more copies, thru their various gimmicks (100:1 so-called “incentives”, variant covers, etc).

            LOL! Yeah…Marvel…”trapped retailers”…That’s as far as that limb can reach…

            You just don’t know when to quit, do you? Instead of just conceding a point that you know full well you don’t have a leg to stand on, you just keep posting dumb comments, in attempts to save face, regardless of the facts that I keep knocking you in the head with.

            It’s really sad when you don’t know when to keep your mouth shut. You’re not even really refuting anything right now, just talking out your &$$.

            But very well, I’ll just keep kicking you in your head with the facts:

            http://www.bleedingcool.com/20

            I love how “advance PREorders” are somehow better sign of success than, oh I don’t know…ACTUAL SALES?

            LMFAO! Your ignorance and denial of how easily you’re losing this argument really is charming AND sad.

            Meanwhile:

            http://www.bleedingcool.com/20

            Besides the numbers I just gave, look at the comments in both links, especially the second one. Over 100 comments, and none of it is positive about Marvel. And Bleeding Fool is usually a pro-Marvel site. But everyone is complaining about the quality of Marvel’s books as of late. No one is caring about their fake diversity campaign

            And it’s not just that one site, but several others as well. And I know you don’t believe me, so here’s the proof:

            http://comicbook.com/marvel/20

            http://community.comicbookreso

            http://www.ign.com/articles/20

            And that’s just a few of the more popular sites. Page after page, post after post of people expressing their dissatisfaction with Marvel, while there’s a renewed sense of interest in DC.

            Good for you…Go celebrate the victory of winning one month of good PR after YEARS of being bi+chslapped by Marvel…Because a single #1 best seller anomaly in the last couple of years is all the proof you need that DC is doing great, right?

            Too bad long term actual sales tell a different story from the narrative you’re pushing.

            Here’s the problem with what you just said:

            1) Marvel’s not interested in doing retail shops any “favors”. They only did it to hurt DC. So much for “there’s no competition between these companies”, huh?

            2) The books they were trying to get the stores to rip up, were not “excess inventory”. It was Blackest Night, literally THE highest selling comic book of the past decade.

            3) Marvel was asking retailers to rip up 50 DC books, for 1 Marvel book as an incentive. Not only is this massively out of balance, but the 1 Marvel book they were trying to pedal, wasn’t even that great of a book to begin with. So, you’re going to trade 50 of your top selling books, for one mediocre book????

            1) Since those covers would already be sold, there’s no way they could’ve hurt DC. If anything, it gave retailers the confidence that they could keep buying DC books, no matter how crappy, and if they didn’t sell, get a refund from Marvel.

            2) If it was THE highest selling comic book of the past decade, why did retailers take Marvel up on their offer instead of actually getting some money from those books?

            3) And yet retailers still did it…guess that “mediocre book” was still worth more than those 50 titles…

            Oh, and here’s a random fault on the part of Marvel: What about when they overcharge people for their movie tickets?

            http://www.cinemablend.com/new

            http://www.slashfilm.com/aveng

            This isn’t even about them overcharging people…shows how much your reading skill leave to desire…

            So while this is technically not Marvel per se, I’m left to wonder 2 things: If WB had jacked the price up for BVS:

            1) Would it have made well over $1B, since it was only $100M shy of the $B mark?

            2) Since the Disney story didn’t pick up any traction, I wonder how people would have reacted, if WB/DC engaged in the same dirty business practices?

            1) No…WB can’t jack up the price because their recent movies have been disappointments…they would’ve LOST money.
            2) People would’ve laughed at WB’s attempt to dictate theater deal terms for a franchise with no leverage. It’s all theoretical because they just can’t.

            So, instead of proving me wrong, which you already know you can’t do, you’ll just stick your head in the sand, and act like you’re in denial?

            *sigh*

            https://www.facebook.com/group

            This time you only get one link. I’m tired of giving you several links, just to act like you don’t know WTF I’m talking about.

            But the point is, Marvel doesn’t have an in-house manufacturer, so every piece of merch they have is licensed to other companies. At this point, comics is the only in-house product that Marvel makes.

            Meanwhile, guess who owns DC Collectibles?

            Slick move, but you said Marvel had a “serious quality control deficit when it comes to toys, because it’s all licensed, vs DC’s being all in-house”. Still waiting for the proof of those “quality control issues”…

            Arrow is on a small network, and a paid cable network at that. Meanwhile, AoShit is A) on a major network, and B) has the backing of a huge “Cinematic Universe”, and yet it still can barely do better than DC’s so-called “$#!+” show.

            AoShit should be taking in 5 times the amount of viewers. But instead, it’s on the brink of getting cancelled, while Arrow isn’t.

            Whaaah! Mah show is not on a popular network owned by one of the biggest media companies int the world…Wah! Still can’t explain how the show with the better ratings is somehow worse than the turds over at CW…

            1) Netflix itself is a mediocre service, so of course they are going to ask for anything that will help boost sales and views for them. That’s not anything to brag about.

            2) You keep saying CBS “and others” are passing on DC. Even if I acquiesce to your CBS point (which I don’t), who are these “others” you are trying to slide in? Because you have yet to produce ANY facts here. Not a single reference, no links, nothing. You’re just talking out your &$$.

            1) Wonder why Netflix are not asking for DC exclusives…
            2) LOL…was the experience of Constantine so bad you already wiped it off your memory? Of the show being cancelled by NBC before it even finished the first season? Haha!

            In much the same light as how you try to say BVS should have done much better, given the marketing campaign they unleashed, the very same applies to Marvel on Netflix. The movie fans are not showing up for this stuff. Where are they? Why is that?

            The reality is, you don’t have an answer. And that’s why you can’t even begin to entertain the question. There’s a 90% drop-off from film to TV for Marvel, and you’re stumped as to why, despite the false “It’s all connected” gimmick.

            Boy, you’re really getting desperate to find something to attack Marvel with, even going so far as to create a false metric between 2 different mediums…You’re the ONLY person brainwrecked enough to make this stupid comparison. Sorry that BvS sucked, but that’s no reason to go crazy with a made up bar created for the sole purpose of bashing Marvel.

            You keep saying this, like it’s supposed to mean something. Arrow’s numbers are irrelevant. None of DCTV shows are getting cancelled, nor are they in any danger of such.

            But I know you read the link I posted, where it’s been admitted that AoShit is on the chopping block.

            Neither are Marvel shows on any “chopping block”, so WTF are you on about? Which Marvel show hasn’t been already renewed? None, that’s which.

            Ah yes, the typical “Marvel’s movies are great, and that’s all that matters” argument.

            …along with your typical strawman argument. Because we all know you’d lose if you tried to address the actual point for once…

            Prove it. And not with those janky-&$$ numbers you posted before, because I shredd that nonsense already.

            No you have not. All you’re doing is dismissing the evidence that’s inconvenient for your argument, but you never proved it was wrong. You only threw a tantrum about it.

            Wow, really? So you just chopped up the quote, and only posted the part that fed your narrative, as if I’m too dumb to look up the rest of the quote?

            Here’s what was actually said:

            “I think it found the right home. It’s a win-win for us. We co-own the CW and we made a great deal with Warner Bros.”

            Gellar added, “Who’s to say if we hadn’t made that deal that we wouldn’t have picked it up.”
            So there was nothing to lose, especially since CBS owns CW. Once, NOTHING was in danger of getting cancelled.

            If “NOTHING was in danger of getting cancelled”, she wouldn’t be talking about falling ratings in the first place…That last comment shows how uncommitted they were.

            Because were it not for WB, Marvel wouldn’t have a decent game right now.

            Again, a game with the same review score as Lego Avengers gets lambasted, but Lego Avengers, again with the same score, is “decent”…hypocrisy much?

            You were saying?

            That Marvel just made $10B in total movie revenues, a feat no other studio has emulated…All without Lego branding.

            Just like Marvel cares about dumping as many movies, comics, and toys as possible, and not being concerned with them being better, right?

            Your whining is only based on anger from DC not being lauded as highly as you think they should, which is the reason why your accusations only consist of repeating the same criticism back toward Marvel, without any kind of reasoning…That right there tells me you’re running out of arguments and are growing increasingly frustrated by it.

            Riiiiight. When did that happen, again? Post some links of when you “owned” me. Because all you’ve done, since I first began talking to you, is deflecting with your one-liners.

            This same page is proof. You wanted to claim WB wins a non-battle with Marvel over SDCC when the fact is Marvel has proven their success doesn’t rely on it; you know dam well that Marvel content has received positive responses from the general public and fans, so you resort to fake arguments and nonsense standards that NOBODY else uses to eke out the victory you want so badly.

            I dare you to pick a Marvel film, and discuss it with me. But we both know you’re gonna run and buck dance.

            We’ve already discussed them ad nauseaum; and I know you’re trying to drag the discussion into a tangent, to distract from the fact that Marvel’s strategy has paid off both critically AND financially.

            LMAO, you just made that BS up. Prove right now, that this is their game plan.

            Marvel Studios started their live franchise in 2008, their TV content production in 2013, and now they’re working on creating new videogames this year. If you can’t see a staggered pattern here, you’re really slow on the take.

            Yep, just like AoShit is on the chopping block of cancellation. How’s that working out?

            Don’t know…All I know is that there’s not a single Marvel show on the “chopping block”, or with worse ratings than Arrow and Legends of Tomorrow…FACT

            That’s not what I said, you illiterate idiot. My statement was as follows;

            All their other TV projects have either been cancelled, or shut down in pre-production.

            …Really? You’re joking, right? Did you notice that I quoted you word for word, or is your retardation affecting your ability to process writing?

            Accomplishing something in half a decade is not a qualifier for being ahead of the game. Which Marvel is not, when it comes to TV.

            Again, I never said Marvel was ahead on TV…but it seems this concept is too hard to grasp for you…

            When you have more shows than DC, then you can talk. And when you have shows with higher ratings than DC’s highest rated shows do, then you can talk.

            When DC doesn’t occupy the top 2 spots for “Worst comic book shows on TV”, let me know.

            As far as comics go, I’ve already shown you that Marvel is slowly losing ground on the comics aspect, which was tedious as it is, even with their felonious business practices.

            No, you just invented a pathetically contrived excuse to rationalize your claim that Marvel is losing to DC despite the fact they’ve been outselling DC for ages.

            Actually, as of this coming fall, NBC will have the same number of DC shows, as ABC has Marvel shows. And NBC’s DC show won’t be on the verge of cancellation, the way ABC’s Marvel show is.

            Even if Agents WAS on the chopping block (which is easily disproven by it’s immediate season 4 renewal…), being on the chopping block is infinitely times better than GETTING the chop like Costantine and Supergirl did.

            It’s pathietic how you want to pretend that DC is still superior after 2 of it’s shows were rejected after one season…they’re WAAAY past being on “the chopping block”…Supergirl had to be rescued from CBS’ chopping block so that DC could save face, while Constantine was fed to the CW/DC dogs…

            For someone that likes to play the “throwing stuff at the wall” argument for DC’s shows, you sure have no probs with Marvel throwing their print product to that very same wall.

            Also, just so you’re aware, Marvel’s paper quality has long since been subpar, in comparison to DC’s. It’s thin, it bleeds, and it tears easily, especially during shipping. Also, DC pays their creators a higher page rate than Marvel does.

            Sure, I’ll believe you. So sad that this is the best and only legitimate argument you can throw at Marvel…a complaint about paper quality. Fun stuff.

            Wow, really? This is the argument you wanna use in favor of Netflix, but someohow that doesn’t apply to DCTV on the CW?

            Why would it? Last I checked, watching CW is free, so anybody interested can watch (keyword here is “interested”...)

            But beyond that fact, once again I ask: how do you account for GoT wiping out EVERYTHING (with the exception of sports and the news)? HBO has the highest pay sub cost, and yet it’s shows are ranking higher than almost everything on TV

            Because GoT is a long running show with a bigger fanbase and more buzz than any other show on TV. If it was on network TV, with the same quality, the ratings would be astronomical.

            NOTHING with Marvel’s name on it is doing more than 5M viewers on TV. And that’s whether it’s on a major network with a primetime schedule, or on the so-called fastest growing streaming service.

            “The Full House continuation was a much bigger hit with audiences than it was with critics, with an average of 21.5 million viewers.

            Then comes Making a Murderer (19.4 million), Daredevil (11.7), The Ranch (9.5), Jessica Jones (9.3), House of Cards (9.1), F Is For Family (7.0), Master of None (5.85), Love (4.1), Flaked (2.1), and With Bob & David (1.0).”

            http://www.wetpaint.com/netflix-ratings-most-popular-shows-1502468/#up-nextList

            You didn’t prove anything, and you don’t want to address it, because you know you can’t. HBO costs nearly twice as much a month as Netflix, and yet the lowest rated HBO original show outranks the highest Netflix show. And this is with the fact that HBO NEVER advertises their content

            Yeah…
            http://www.adweek.com/files/adfreak/images/2/GOT-Building.jpg
            …they
            http://www.adweek.com/prnewser/files/2013/03/got-1-JPG_185959.jpg
            …NEVER
            http://inagorillacostume.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/Sopranos-Taxi-Ads.jpg
            …advertise
            http://d2j0lgmf0ukdnf.cloudfront.net/archive/_cache/_249497_5_01928675c810bae609dab06d7084a1ec.jpg
            ……ever
            http://andrewprokos.com/d/hbo-couches-ads?g2_itemId=18893
            ……EVER
            http://cdn.drprem.com/marketing/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2012/08/hung-bb1_d9s1H_28802.jpg

            There’s no justification whatsoever for Marvel Netflix’s weak numbers. Again, with a massive cinematic universe backing it, Marvel should be blowing EVERYTHING out of the water.

            Your attempt to project the criticism of the DCCU onto the Marvel TV universe is more transparent than air. Unfortunately there’s a huge difference; Marvel TV has nothing by which you can justify saying they should be “blowing EVERYTHING out of the water”…since there’s nothing else like it. Tell me what other interconnected movie/TV franchise translates more movie viewers into TV viewers? That’s right, there’s none. Because Marvel is the first to do it. So they’re their own standard. Nice try though.

            But the reality is, you don’t have an answer, and I’m wagering that it probably keeps you up at night, most likely the same as it does Marvel. None of your Marvel overlords can figure out why their film success is not translating over to other mediums, where they suffer from mediocrity at best, and nothing whatsoever at worst.

            LMFAO! Keep dreaming…Nobody cares about a made-up standard you pulled out of your @$$ so you can tickle yourself to sleep dreaming of Marvel failing at something you want to pretend is important, since in any REAL metric they’re obviously either dominating or doing well enough. What next, the MCU doesn’t have enough people named Martha, so therefore it’s a failure, right?

            LOL! GTFO…

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